Windows 10?

[Baxter49]

My vista computer broke during summer, purchased a new one with windows 8, upgraded to 10 via download on original roll-out date and hated it along with 8.

It was like 8-10 was setup to be anti-user friendly, or track our information with Cortina. Could not pin what you wanted to start and menu bars or even little things like put fire fox icon on toolbar where you click on it and a new window opens.

I know Vista is not popular but it was far easier than 10 or 8.

Got some tech support to fix my vista computer and started again, returned the windows 8 computer upgraded to windows 10.

How is it an improvement when you cannot set up your start menu or tool bars with what you want and worse when you have to go to search bar to find things.

Never had xp, never had 7, went from windows 98 to vista to windows 8/10 and was less user friendly then anything I ever had back to windows 95.

If anyone tells me why I'm wrong would be happy to read that. Not the most tech savy person but was able to keep my vista going since 2007 and made countless changes.

[rlg118]

There are lots of Windows 7 laptops for sale on Amazon.

[spicoli]

Originally Posted by Baxter49

My vista computer broke during summer, purchased a new one with windows 8, upgraded to 10 via download on original roll-out date and hated it along with 8.

It was like 8-10 was setup to be anti-user friendly, or track our information with Cortina. Could not pin what you wanted to start and menu bars or even little things like put fire fox icon on toolbar where you click on it and a new window opens.

I know Vista is not popular but it was far easier than 10 or 8.

Got some tech support to fix my vista computer and started again, returned the windows 8 computer upgraded to windows 10.

How is it an improvement when you cannot set up your start menu or tool bars with what you want and worse when you have to go to search bar to find things.

Never had xp, never had 7, went from windows 98 to vista to windows 8/10 and was less user friendly then anything I ever had back to windows 95.

If anyone tells me why I'm wrong would be happy to read that. Not the most tech savy person but was able to keep my vista going since 2007 and made countless changes.

I battled with Vista also - after about a year it worked ok. As for a solution to your present dilemma see http://vintage-erotica-forum.com/sho...&postcount=675

[Rick Danger]

Originally Posted by 9876543210

Don't know where you are but there are probably quite a few good machines there that will be less expensive and will have Win 7 or 8 on them.

I have respect for Windows 7. After the "Vista Wars", I had hope that Windows 7 meant that Microsoft was back on track. Then came Windows 8, and now the "blessing" of Windows 10.

So Windows 7 may be the last "good" Windows release. It's a shame that Redmond is desperately pushing for it's demise. And now the strong-arm tactics being applied to hardware OEMs. And I still have to ask: how can Microsoft be allowed to force an OEM to stop selling it's own inventory? I thought "restraint of trade" was a crime?

Food, water, batteries, medical supplies, ammo … and Windows 7 PCs
Microsoft names the day when OEMs must stop selling Windows 7

The Register UK
By Simon Sharwood, 3 Nov 2015 at 04:56

Microsoft has named the day on which it will force PC-makers to stop shipping PCs with Windows 7 pre-installed.

The Windows Lifecycle fact sheet has been updated to record the fact that as of October 31, 2016 no more PCs will be sold with Windows 7 Professional burned onto the boot disk.

Retail sales of Windows 7, all versions, ceased way back on October 31st 2013.

Microsoft's herding users towards Windows 10, and is unafraid to crack the whip along the way. Announcing the end of OEM sales for Windows 7 isn't necessarily part of that plan as users will have had seven years to get their hands on product by the time the curtain comes down.

By the time the PC supply dries up, Windows 10 will also be more than a year old and Microsoft's Windows-as-a-service will likely be upon us. If you really do need to keep some pristine Windows 7 PCs on hand by then, you might just be the kind of person who also keeps freeze-dried food and similar supplies in the basement already. ®

[Rick Danger]

Very early on we discussed on this thread the questionable logic of any strategy for Windows 10 tied to propping up the weak selling Windows Phone line. A classic "tail wagging the dog" scenario.

According to International Data Corporation's (IDC) Worldwide Quarterly Mobile Phone Tracker (2Q 2015), Windows Phone represents a paltry 2.6% of the global smartphone market. This is compared to Android (82.8%) and Apple's iOS (13.9%). Android has taken marketshare from both Apple and Microsoft this year.

To add more gloom to the Windows Phone picture, here is a review of Windows Mobile 10 Build 10581, the first major release of Windows 10 on this platform. To sum it up "...with code of this quality, the company should seriously consider whether it needs to be developing a Mobile version of Windows at all."

Sleepless nights in Redmond, no doubt. Microsoft is still trying to recover from the huge lack of strategic vision of former CEO Steve Ballmer when he charted their mobile technology strategy.

Microsoft Windows Mobile 10: Uphill battle with 'work in progress'
Build 10581 on the block

By Andrew Orlowski, 9 Nov 2015 at 17:29
The Register UK

Review
As the first major milestone release of Windows 10 Mobile nears, Microsoft still has much work to do to bring on the system fluency and capabilities of its predecessor, let alone its established mobile rivals.

Microsoft customers who have taken advantage of Windows Phone to equip field works with modern mobile applications, and who have realigned their development strategy with Universal Windows, may want to spend longer evaluating the client release of Windows 10: for the system today lacks the fit and finish they’ve come to expect. We reviewed Build 10572 two weeks ago.

The development of Windows Mobile needs to hit the milestone in order to appear in two new Microsoft Lumia devices, due to ship on 3 December.

The Lumia 950 and 950 XL models are already listed for pre-order. So we took the latest “fast ring” W10M Build 10581 through its paces.

Although performance and battery life are much improved since builds released earlier this year, this build included no new features, so what you see here is likely to be in the shipping ROMs – and the first OTA updates to upgrade-compatible Windows Phones.

And that matters, because there are major shortcomings in vital areas. Here, we’ve outlined the key differences to Windows Phone 8.1.

The Good
Real mobile Office: Office has been included since the “reboot” of Microsoft’s phone range in 2010, and no client license was needed.

The applications conformed with the Metro (later ‘Modern’) design guidelines but were simplistic, and using them was hampered (until recently) by lack of support for peripherals, such as a Bluetooth keyboard.

Office on Android and iOS streaked ahead. Office on Windows 10 Mobile finally has feature parity on Windows, and it’s a much richer and more capable feature set.

Using the devices on a small screen is a challenge the designers have had trouble dealing with. The features are divided between a “hamburger” menu in the top left and an “overflow” menu, the traditional Windows Phone menu.

In Office, this provides a formatting bar. Users should be reasonably familiar with either, but throughout Window 10 Mobile it isn’t clear which is used for which category of features. Office remains the best thought out of the applications Microsoft has revamped.

Better notifications and settings: Microsoft has put further work into the combination notifications/settings panel (“Action Centre”) a straight lift of Android’s pulldown which appeared in Windows Phone 8.1 last year.

While the intention appears to be to make Notifications “actionable”, this isn’t evident in this build.

By contrast, Android users can choose from a range of to Notifications from the lock screen or the Notifications shade. One of the quick settings is not a Setting but a shortcut to OneNote.

Maps: As with the full fat version of Windows 10, Microsoft’s default Maps offering is now much improved, allowing offline maps licensed from HERE. Maps integrates elements from two applications HERE Drive and Maps. Maps on W10M now includes 3D flyovers of selected cities.

Edge browser: Edge represents a significant step forward over the Internet Explorer mobile found in Windows Phone, and has now been fleshed out with more of a basic browser's features. Edge waits before rendering the page, but the waits aren’t long: the perceived speed increase is real.

Do Not Track requests are off, but so too is Page Prediction. At this stage in their respective development cycles, Edge on mobile compares favourably with the desktop version.

Other positives: Power drain is now close to Windows 8.1 levels.

Note that to make full use of the much vaunted ‘Continuum’ feature, allowing the phone to serve as a surrogate PC, it is only available on new hardware; existing devices only permit display mirroring.

The Bad ... and The Ugly
Messaging and PIM: The collapse of BlackBerry and successful commoditisation of Exchange as a standard should have given Microsoft a significant advantage, but it’s failed to grasp it.

The Windows Phone 8.1 email client was rudimentary, but in real life use performs far better than the Windows 10 Mobile application tested here. The current WP8.1 version allows the rapid processing of multiple messages across accounts, whiled unread or flagged messages could be isolated using a simple sideways swipe gesture.

The current Windows Phone allows accounts to be aggregated in a unified inbox. It enabled richer workflows by specifying the synchronisation of an Exchange or IMAP folder. All this has been lost in the move to a “unified” email client across Windows 10, which on Mobile represents a significant step backwards.

Strangely, this build allows you to pin individual accounts to the Start screen, but these don't “resolve” to the specific account. The live tile for a pinned account will show email from any of the accounts. It’s a cosmetic trick that fails to convince.

More worryingly, Exchange failed to deliver mail for hours until being prodded to do so via the manual sync button.

For some 900 million Exchange users worldwide, iOS, Blackberry and Android offer much more mature third-party clients than either Microsoft’s own Windows 10 mobile client, or its clients on other platforms. The rapid rise in adoption of Slack suggests that businesses are keen to try alternatives to email, and Microsoft is experimenting with innovative “garage” messaging alternatives of its own such as Send.

But Microsoft can’t afford to continue supplying a third-rate experience. The company has not bought wisely, a third-rate experience is now standard across all its mobile platforms.

Bugs: The current build significantly accelerates some of the transition effects that have plagued Windows 10 Mobile testers all year, giving the impression of a more mature product.

However even after a full wipe and restore, the system feels far from finished. The start screen consistently crashes (blanking and then restoring its contents) a couple of times a minute. Transitions also seem haphazard: the smooth resizing of tiles has been replaced by a laggy and jerky experience.

More worryingly, key apps such as Messaging appear half finished.

Imaging: Even after a full wipe and restore, imaging was a poor experience. Eventually (see Store section) the phone replaced the Lumia camera with a new camera app. The results were muddy, and shortcuts failed to open any camera app at all. The Photo app is more ambitious, defaulting to the OneDrive camera roll in the cloud. It will be harder for novices to find images taken on the phone.

Store: The test device took almost two days to complete the installation of requested applications. Some inexplicably were never installed, but the Store server replaced them with an alternative. This represents an improvement over earlier builds which never completed installing key applications at all.

Visual Coherence: Windows 10 Mobile appears a work-in-progress, riddled with visual inconsistencies and strange choices. The typography-inspired Windows Phone 7 design uses text labels as buttons, and this still applies throughout Windows 10 too. However, there are many situations where it isn’t apparent that the text is “actionable”. Conversely there are “actionable” items which because of bugs, don’t perform any actions.

The most criticised of the design choices is “Hamburger menus”, which put important menu items out of reach, with no swipe option as on Android. On practice many small details have been changed for no apparent reason.

Many of the metaphors have been broken; apps “zoom” in when started, rather than flip, implying that there’s a depth layer. The use of circles instead of squares is also odd, when the system is largely defined by rectangular furniture. Windows 10 Mobile adopts the wireframe icons of the “full fat” version in many places (the Action Centre) but not others (Tiles and Icons).

Build 10581: the Verdict
Windows 10 Mobile is not only a work in progress, and a rough one, but a surprisingly amateurish experience. Microsoft has set very ambitious goal of converging upon a universal code base and a universal API. But it has compromised its user experience because the needs of users, on mobile and PC, remain very different.

Microsoft has pushed Windows 10 very aggressively at PC users, even apologising for being heavy handed. If it attempts such tactics with mobile users it may regret it. Mobile devices, more than desktops, are expected to “just work”, and the bugs here such as failing to fetch email fall into the show-stopper category.

Microsoft has been pushing "Mobile First and Cloud First" as its corporate mantra for some 18 months. Only part of that commitment has borne fruit. If rapid improvements are not made then Microsoft, which is already far behind iOS and Android, risks falling even further behind.

It's hard to see that happening; with code of this quality, the company should seriously consider whether it needs to be developing a Mobile version of Windows at all.

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/11...h_wm10/?page=1

[Rick Danger]

When facing the crushing weight of marketshare that Android and iPhone devices enjoy on the global market, it is critical for Microsoft to build a rich catalog of apps for Windows 10 Mobile. But how do you convince application developers to spend time and resources on a platform that is less than 3% of the market?

One approach that the rocket scientists at Redmond devised was by simply porting apps from the Android and iOS stores over to Windows 10 Mobile. But apparently a key piece of that strategy, code named "Astoria" is not up to the task.

First, slow (if not negative) growth of Windows 10 in the months after it's end of July release. And now bad news on the Windows 10 Mobile front.

Sounds like TWO STRIKES to me. Who said baseball season is over?


ExtremeTech.com
Microsoft’s Android app emulation for Windows 10 Mobile ‘not going as planned’

By Jamie Lendino on November 16, 2015 at 11:35 am

Back at this year’s Build conference, Microsoft said that it will make available tools to port apps from other platforms, including iOS and Android. Now it looks like the Android tool — dubbed Astoria — won’t be available any time soon, if ever.

Windows Central is reporting “from multiple sources” that Project Astoria is now on hold indefinitely, and “may even be shelved completely.” For its part, Microsoft hasn’t said much about Astoria recently, and one source told the site that “the Android app porting is not going as planned.” It also looks like Windows 10 Build 10586 has the Android subsystem removed completely.

Why was Astoria important? It’s no secret that the Windows 10 Mobile app catalog is not only not on par with Android and iOS, but is in fact shrinking as of late as big-name developers have begun pulling out support for the struggling Microsoft phone platform. Project Astoria for Android, along with Westminster for porting Web apps, Centennial for Win32 apps, and Islandwood for iOS apps, were all in efforts to bulk up Windows 10 Mobile’s app support.

There’s lots of speculation as to what the reason for shelving Project Astoria could be, including Windows app developers not being happy about Astoria existing, or that there were performance issues with the Android subsystem loaded in Windows 10.

A Microsoft spokesperson said the following to Windows Central:

“We’re committed to offering developers many options to bring their apps to the Windows Platform, including bridges available now for Web and iOS, and soon Win32. The Astoria bridge is not ready yet, but other tools offer great options for developers.”

App emulation has never been a great solution for inflating a platform’s supported app catalog. With the exception of totally internal emulation, such as PowerPC apps running under OS X via Rosetta, usually emulating apps means poorer-performing versions than they are under their native OS, and emulation also acts as disincentive for developers to develop new, properly designed apps that capture the native platform’s UI conventions and take advantage of its optimized code. BlackBerry ran into this when it included a modicum of Android support within BlackBerry 10, and ended up falling flat on its face.

Back in February, IDC research was already showing that almost the entire world market (96.3 percent) was coalescing around Android and iOS, and that while shipments of Windows Phones (as they were called at the time) increased slightly, its market share had fallen back down below three percent. Windows Phone owners tend to love their devices, but the lack of a healthy app and third-party accessory ecosystem around the platform, not to mention a severe lack of flagship devices aside from the Lumia 1020 and HTC One M8, made it difficult for the mobile OS to gain traction.

In the end, we’re not sure it’s going to matter. During the Build conference, we asked readers whether they cared if Windows 10 Mobile can run Android or iOS apps, and the answer was mostly “not really.” Simply put, what I said above is the reason: Android apps running on Windows 10 Mobile devices will look like Android apps, and one of the best things about Windows Phone devices have been its unique and interesting UI idiom.

[Baxter49]

Originally Posted by spicoli

I battled with Vista also - after about a year it worked ok. As for a solution to your present dilemma see http://vintage-erotica-forum.com/sho...&postcount=675

Thank You. I had Vista since 2007 and aside from the folder issues, never had problems that I did not create via my own changes. The rare blue screens were repaired automatically. This computer is usually on 10 hours a day or more so I got my money's worth.

My summer 2015 problem began because I combined C-D drives to create more free space and it worked perfect. When the OS began running slower/hotter a few months later decided to use Windows Vista nuclear F10 option (had everything backed up) but because I combined drives there was nothing to restart with and the backup CD recovery discs were no good. The tech support service had me use the new computer, download something to clear bios, wipe drive to all zero's and after buying a new vista CD I able to start over which means 200+ updates plus sp1/sp2 but finally got there.

The windows 8 upgraded to windows 10 went back to HSN.

Never understood why Vista is rated so poorly by so many. Windows 10 simply does not allow some basics on task bar or start menu.

In the two weeks before I returned that computer Windows 10 was brand new so never got an update, I since learned they tried forcing 10 updates on 7, 8 users.

[Rick Danger]

Originally Posted by Baxter49

Never understood why Vista is rated so poorly by so many.

Why? For me, it was simple. It's hard to do anything productive with a machine that crashed every FIVE HOURS or so. And it was a BRAND NEW laptop!

To be blunt, I don't care how slick the user interface (UI) is, or how many "feel good" apps it comes with. If my operating system is slow, constantly freezing or crashing, or hanging up with the dread "blue screen of death" (BSOD) because I unplugged a mouse, it's nothing but a millstone keeping me from doing my work.

To spare you having to dial back to the beginning of this thread, Vista was a bloated nightmare. Microsoft's "official" Windows Vista magazine stated that full blown Vista, including the "Aero Glass" user interface would run in 1Gb of RAM. My laptop with 1Gb couldn't reliably run Vista BASIC.

The User Account Control constantly blocked apps that I had properly installed. In short, unlike network firewall software, the Vista UAC never retained "memory" of my approved apps. The UAC had the intelligence of a dead clam. Apple had a commercial that poked fun at UAC. Sadly, I didn't find it all that funny......https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FxOIebkmrqs

Vista was a big resource hog. That's why you never saw Vista on small devices like GPS units. It was always Windows CE, the "Lost Windows". See, even Bill didn't remember Windows CE...............

I rebuilt my Vista machine twice, upgraded memory, and turned off certain overhead features like the search indexing. It finally became a stable system.

I never bothered with Windows 7, because frankly the time and cost of getting Vista to work properly meant I had no desire to repeat the experience. Had Microsoft compensated my "pain and suffering" with a free Windows 7 upgrade, I would have gladly jumped onboard. But I was done laying out more money to Redmond at that point.

While I did not have the same level of difficulty with Windows 8, I do acknowledge that the Metro (i.e., touchscreen) UI is a waste of time for me. But I bought a new laptop with Windows 8. My Vista machine was a casualty of "Superstorm" Sandy. From the standpoint of stability and performance, Windows 8 is far ahead of Vista. I've never had a BSOD or other crash on my Windows 8 machines.

If you had the money to buy or build a high level PC or laptop to run Vista, you probably had a good experience. Even though I bought a brand new machine that I assumed was up to specifications (esp. given Microsoft's stated system requirements) my experience was totally unsatisfactory. And yes, I fully acknowledge that my trust in Microsoft was the biggest casualty of the "Vista Wars". So all of the promises and marketing hype about Windows 10 fall on deaf ears. I've heard it all before....

[Baxter49]

Originally Posted by Rick Danger

Why? For me, it was simple. It's hard to do anything productive with a machine that crashed every FIVE HOURS or so. And it was a BRAND NEW laptop!

To be blunt, I don't care how slick the user interface (UI) is, or how many "feel good" apps it comes with. If my operating system is slow, constantly freezing or crashing, or hanging up with the dread "blue screen of death" (BSOD) because I unplugged a mouse, it's nothing but a millstone keeping me from doing my work.

To spare you having to dial back to the beginning of this thread, Vista was a bloated nightmare. Microsoft's "official" Windows Vista magazine stated that full blown Vista, including the "Aero Glass" user interface would run in 1Gb of RAM. My laptop with 1Gb couldn't reliably run Vista BASIC.

The User Account Control constantly blocked apps that I had properly installed. In short, unlike network firewall software, the Vista UAC never retained "memory" of my approved apps. The UAC had the intelligence of a dead clam. Apple had a commercial that poked fun at UAC. Sadly, I didn't find it all that funny......https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FxOIebkmrqs

Vista was a big resource hog. That's why you never saw Vista on small devices like GPS units. It was always Windows CE, the "Lost Windows". See, even Bill didn't remember Windows CE...............

I rebuilt my Vista machine twice, upgraded memory, and turned off certain overhead features like the search indexing. It finally became a stable system.

I never bothered with Windows 7, because frankly the time and cost of getting Vista to work properly meant I had no desire to repeat the experience. Had Microsoft compensated my "pain and suffering" with a free Windows 7 upgrade, I would have gladly jumped onboard. But I was done laying out more money to Redmond at that point.

While I did not have the same level of difficulty with Windows 8, I do acknowledge that the Metro (i.e., touchscreen) UI is a waste of time for me. But I bought a new laptop with Windows 8. My Vista machine was a casualty of "Superstorm" Sandy. From the standpoint of stability and performance, Windows 8 is far ahead of Vista. I've never had a BSOD or other crash on my Windows 8 machines.

If you had the money to buy or build a high level PC or laptop to run Vista, you probably had a good experience. Even though I bought a brand new machine that I assumed was up to specifications (esp. given Microsoft's stated system requirements) my experience was totally unsatisfactory. And yes, I fully acknowledge that my trust in Microsoft was the biggest casualty of the "Vista Wars". So all of the promises and marketing hype about Windows 10 fall on deaf ears. I've heard it all before....

Sorry about what's happened.

This is my vista except it was 19 inches.
http://www.cnet.com/products/acer-as...am-120-gb-hdd/

Cost $1000.00 in 2007, usual worthless software included, no printer, scanner or word/excel.

I must have been very naive or lucky (likely both) because never had your problems, or bothered with acer's extra's or aero glass. I have the 2gb ram 120 gb hd and my repairs with a new vista cd have 85gb free of the 111gb listed on C Drive.

cd's run like garbage on Vista, half the time the autoplay does not activate and time for another blank cd/burn even after it saves data for use on other computers and ejects automatically.

I also bought that click free crap, after three years it crashed while running and kept locking up IE so had to keep holding power button after unplugging it.

$450.00 to send to someone to recover and put my lost data on a new storage device. Now I have three of them.

Cross fingers the amount of blue screens I have had were extremely rare and fixed themselves. Once I installed an anti-virus which erased the restore points so I had to go back to beginning (but unlike above last summer) the vista system was in tact so just had to wait for a few hundred updates to download.

Before my problem last summer was worried it was running too hot, and too many resources being used, bought a new fan (four bucks) but basically the entire computer had to be dissembled to get at the fan after 60 screws (even bought a kit of Phillips screwdrivers) but decided to go for F10 option which caused my problem in previous post because I combined drives.

Sorry, too much rambling about vista in windows 10 subject. Just wanted to share how I got to try windows 10 for two weeks and how flat out infuriating that experience was with a beautiful bright machine that was 10x work to do basic navigation.

[spicoli]

Originally Posted by Baxter49

Sorry about what's happened.

This is my vista except it was 19 inches.
http://www.cnet.com/products/acer-as...am-120-gb-hdd/

Cost $1000.00 in 2007, usual worthless software included, no printer, scanner or word/excel.

I must have been very naive or lucky (likely both) because never had your problems, or bothered with acer's extra's or aero glass. I have the 2gm ram 120 gb hd and my repairs with a new vista cd have 85gm free of the 111gm listed on C Drive.

cd's run like garbage on Vista, half the time the autoplay does not activate and time for another blank cd/burn even after it saves data for use on other computers and ejects automatically.

I also bought that click free crap, after three years it crashed while running and kept locking up IE so had to keep holding power button after unplugging it.

$450.00 to send to someone to recover and put my lost data on a new storage device. Now I have three of them.

Cross fingers the amount of blue screens I have had were extremely rare and fixed themselves. Once I installed an anti-virus which erased the restore points so I had to go back to beginning (but unlike above last summer) the vista system was in tact so just had to wait for a few hundred updates to download.

Before my problem last summer was worried it was running too hot, and too many resources being used, bought a new fan (four bucks) but basically the entire computer had to be dissembled to get at the fan after 60 screws (even bought a kit of Phillips screwdrivers) but decided to go for F10 option which caused my problem in previous post because I combined drives.

Sorry, too much rambling about vista in windows 10 subject. Just wanted to share how I got to try windows 10 for two weeks and how flat out infuriating that experience was with a beautiful bright machine that was 10x work to do basic navigation.

I never had any trouble with Vista after getting it sorted out. XP was good from the start but the company that I am affiliated forced us to go to 7 or 8 after MS ended support. We chose 7 on new PC's and have had no issues. I see no reason to "upgrade" to 10 even if it is free. If it ain't broke .....