Current Politics in the United Kingdom - Page 506

**Old Jud** · January 13th, 2019, 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brecht

Didn't a Polish official recently beg Trump to build a huge US Army (or NATO) base in Poland? He even offered to name it Fort Trump. Need I say more?

The Poles and Ukrainians have been pushing for US bases for some time, the US is (understandably) reluctant to poke it's nose into the old USSR's backyard for fear of provoking comrade Putin, remember what happened when the old USSR got too friendly with comrade Castro?

**haroldeye** · January 13th, 2019, 08:22 PM

Neither the Poles nor the Ukrainians trust the Russians and with very good reason. Russia saw Germany as a partner in the 1930's when both countries trained each others soldiers and airmen. Look how that turned out.

**palo5** · January 13th, 2019, 09:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by haroldeye

Neither the Poles nor the Ukrainians trust the Russians and with very good reason. Russia saw Germany as a partner in the 1930's when both countries trained each others soldiers and airmen. Look how that turned out.

Stop being misleading, Harold, because you know exactly that they were never allies. USSR & Germany knew they would fight each other sooner or later. It was just a question of when. They were ideological enemies

Incidentally, neither Poland nor Ukraine existed as independent states 100 years ago, and both peoples have hated and massacred each other for hundreds of years. It's always been a troubled area, and it's still troubled today

**Roubignol** · January 13th, 2019, 09:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brecht

It's not a dictatorship but the EU isn't either.

EU is dictatorial on several ways.
French professional politicians are afraid to let French people voting, because they know that in case of a referendum, Frexit is very very close to win.
It already happened in 2005 and the result was "No". Sarkozy betrayed French opinion.

East European detached workers put the wage down and kill the jobs.
That's not workers faults, that's the actual rules of economy.
A Polish truckdriver earns 400 € per month, French industry was relocated in Eastern Europe or Asia.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brecht

All this could have been resolved on a European basis with the formulation of clear European interests which take all national interests into account, whether they're German, British, French or Polish.

Yep, but they didn't and still don't.
German and latino nations don't get the same cultures, the same mentalities.
That's German "fault" on several aspects. German workers accepted to get their social protection destroyed (Die Deutschland-Illusion (Marcel Fratzscher)). French and Italian tried, but are tired.

A fact that institutional medias often forget to tell is that German working poors are today legions. Germany is not a working heaven, but German people are able to suffer more than Latino and British ones.

**deepsepia** · January 13th, 2019, 11:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brecht

George Friedman, founder of the neocon propaganda platform Stratfor, once said that Washington's biggest fear is the fusion of German technology/capital and Russian workforce/ressources and that preventing this is US foreign policy's top priority.

Well that has a certain historical reverberation; we're a century past Brest-Litovsk, but maybe we're not actually that far? One of the interesting pieces in this has been Germany's position on Ukraine, where they have substantial interests.

. . . but from a century past to news 'the day":

Quote:

Originally Posted by Theresa May says no Brexit more likely than no deal

Prime Minister Theresa May is making a last-ditch attempt to persuade MPs to back her Brexit deal as Tuesday's key Commons vote looms closer.

She will use a speech on Monday to warn that Parliament is more likely to block Brexit than let the UK leave with no deal.

Mrs May will add that trust in politics will suffer "catastrophic harm" if the referendum result is not implemented.

Labour has vowed to table a vote of no confidence if Mrs May loses.

Its leader Jeremy Corbyn said Labour would vote against the deal and would start moves to trigger a general election if it is voted down.

. . . she's clearly trying to sway "Leave" votes unhappy with her deal, but is that brinksmanship enough?

**scoundrel** · January 14th, 2019, 12:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deepsepia

. . . she's clearly trying to sway "Leave" votes unhappy with her deal, but is that brinksmanship enough?

I would predict that the answer to that is No. Speaking from my own perspective, I am comfortable with the impending defeat of Mrs May's plan, simply because whichiver happens, either a full remain or a no deal Brexit, makes far more sense and serves Britains interests much better than her ridiculous scheme for our future.

**palo5** · January 14th, 2019, 12:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scoundrel

I would predict that the answer to that is No. Speaking from my own perspective, I am comfortable with the impending defeat of Mrs May's plan, simply because whichiver happens, either a full remain or a no deal Brexit, makes far more sense and serves Britains interests much better than her ridiculous scheme for our future.

I never met a real Russian roulette player, as you seem to be

But as 70-year-old von Rundstedt said in 1944 when told he'd never lost a battle: "Wait and see, I'm still young"

**palo5** · January 14th, 2019, 12:29 AM

I got a big surprise yesterday when my cable channel said "Brexit: the uncivil war" was available. I knew about the movie, but never imagined I would see it

**judy84** · January 14th, 2019, 08:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scoundrel

I would predict that the answer to that is No. Speaking from my own perspective, I am comfortable with the impending defeat of Mrs May's plan, simply because whichiver happens, either a full remain or a no deal Brexit, makes far more sense and serves Britains interests much better than her ridiculous scheme for our future.

The EU’s intentions to complete its economic and monetary union – the central feature of its five-year plan commencing after the European elections in May – have come under little scrutiny since the Referendum, and not at all in connection with the shifting sands of Mrs May’s calamitous Brexit negotiations.

The plan is expected to provide the foundation for a further programme whose central aim is to establish the Federal State of Europe by around 2028-30.

https://ec.europa.eu/commission/futu...e-way-ahead_en

Yet our extendable transition period proposed in the Withdrawal Agreement aligns very neatly with this programme, prompting the question of whether Mrs May and her Remainer government are intending that the UK should be positioned – with the WA voted for – to accede to these new treaties with minimal adjustment.

Mrs May has not just achieved personal control of the negotiations, she has taken ownership of Brexit, making it her personal project.Make no mistake, rejecting her WA on Tuesday is the UK’s last chance to gain independence.

https://brexitcentral.com/dont-foole...ssels-forever/

https://www.conservativewoman.co.uk/...-eu-all-along/

**DB83** · January 14th, 2019, 01:05 PM

May-day. May-day.
'
Disturbing' front-pager in today's Mail. Well most front-pagers in the Mail are in-one-way-or-another disturbing.

Reported that a group of MPs will stage a 'coup detat' if the vote goes against the govnmt come the morrow.

They intend to hijack the whole process, including parliamentary business, and get the house to cancel Article 50. Maybe more scare-mongering but still even with a semblence of truth it is disturbing for all manner of reasons.

As for May's 'Plan B' it seems that 'B' stands for Brussels and Beg for more concessions. Then put that to another vote. May-day just became Groundhog-day.

January 13th, 2019, 08:22 PM	#5052
haroldeye Moderator Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Halfwitistan Posts: 5,716 Thanks: 113,553 Thanked 59,974 Times in 5,708 Posts	Neither the Poles nor the Ukrainians trust the Russians and with very good reason. Russia saw Germany as a partner in the 1930's when both countries trained each others soldiers and airmen. Look how that turned out.

January 14th, 2019, 12:29 AM	#5058
palo5 Former Staff Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 16,579 Thanks: 452,836 Thanked 222,658 Times in 16,567 Posts	I got a big surprise yesterday when my cable channel said "Brexit: the uncivil war" was available. I knew about the movie, but never imagined I would see it

January 14th, 2019, 01:05 PM	#5060
DB83 Vintage Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 1,472 Thanks: 1,948 Thanked 12,019 Times in 1,458 Posts	May-day. May-day. ' Disturbing' front-pager in today's Mail. Well most front-pagers in the Mail are in-one-way-or-another disturbing. Reported that a group of MPs will stage a 'coup detat' if the vote goes against the govnmt come the morrow. They intend to hijack the whole process, including parliamentary business, and get the house to cancel Article 50. Maybe more scare-mongering but still even with a semblence of truth it is disturbing for all manner of reasons. As for May's 'Plan B' it seems that 'B' stands for Brussels and Beg for more concessions. Then put that to another vote. May-day just became Groundhog-day.