Atheist, are you one?? - Page 179

lip · January 23rd, 2018, 05:40 AM

That't what I just don't get. Why is it so important that people go to war for it?

**cicciobuki** · January 23rd, 2018, 08:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lip

That't what I just don't get. Why is it so important that people go to war for it?

(For the have-nots) there is also the punishment and reward (heaven / hell) that probably plays a role in all of this. If you believe in those things (an eternal afterlife) then the stakes might get raised quite a lot.

limbodan · January 23rd, 2018, 03:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lip

... All I can come up with to define religion: It's like a hobby for other people...

As a former believer, I can tell you it is nothing like a hobby. It's an extremely powerful (and sometimes harmful) delusion. I would describe it as brainwashing/programming with repeated reinforcement of belief by the other believers one is surrounded by. I was inducted into religion at a young age and it took a long time to realize how absurd it is and completely "wake up" to reality. I've been an atheist for nearly all of my adult life (20+ years) and am still frustrated/ashamed that I could so fully believe something so irrational. Not to mention, I also now have to occasionally deal with those people who once saw me as a good, righteous person, but now treat me as if I'm possessed by Satan.

It's a serious business for believers...

**kogi** · January 23rd, 2018, 04:28 PM

I don't believe in any metaphysical gods though I'm especially critical to the monotheistic gods for moral reasons. The problem of evil has been mentioned but for me the idea of afterlife is the epitome of arrogance. The idea that God created man in his image I find repugnant; especially that we should have some special status compared to the rest of the animal world.

I'm not saying killing a human is comparable to killing a sheep, only that the moral grounds must be sought elsewhere. Interestingly the great moral philosopher Immanuel Kant only accepted the moral argument as "proof" for gods existence, while denying the cosmological, ontological and teleological proofs given by earlier philosophers.

I also want to point out that while I can't endorse the idea of afterlife for humans I do respect believers trying to make the world a better place based on their beliefs. So there is no equivalence between bad ideas held by people and well... bad people.

lip · January 23rd, 2018, 04:34 PM

It's clear to me that my "hobby" comparison is way too harmless for the extreme and fanatic ways religion is used to bring death and destruction into the lives of others.

But it's my main answer when somebody is asking me what religion means to me.

I also have the luxury of living in a country where my only regular contact with religion is the sound of the church clock.

cyrax · January 23rd, 2018, 06:48 PM

Seconded. Those ducking clocks. I hear them in my sleep

**cicciobuki** · January 23rd, 2018, 10:19 PM

If church bells was the only thing religions would inconvenience us with, it would be a pretty decent world

limbodan · January 23rd, 2018, 11:51 PM

38% in U.S. still believe humans divinely created 6-10 thousand years ago.
http://anonym.to/http://news.gallup....s-new-low.aspx

How can this number still be this high? It's not like we Americans haven't had over a century to study/learn modern science.

Shocking. Just shocking.

**Mister Fide** · January 24th, 2018, 01:46 AM

Yes i am an atheist.................God told me i was.

**kogi** · January 24th, 2018, 06:41 PM

An interesting thought is if God showed up in a physical presence (e.g. bearded old man or a flaming bush) and said I'm the solution to everything and your salvation. And you do indeed believe him to be the all-powerful God of Christianity or Islam. Would you submit to his authority!

I would probably fall to hell for my pride.

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January 23rd, 2018, 05:40 AM	#1781
lip Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 239 Thanks: 26,142 Thanked 8,199 Times in 241 Posts	That't what I just don't get. Why is it so important that people go to war for it?

January 23rd, 2018, 04:28 PM	#1784
kogi Cash Whore Poster Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Unfortunately, without the cash & the whoring Posts: 7,985 Thanks: 16,665 Thanked 268,677 Times in 7,809 Posts	I don't believe in any metaphysical gods though I'm especially critical to the monotheistic gods for moral reasons. The problem of evil has been mentioned but for me the idea of afterlife is the epitome of arrogance. The idea that God created man in his image I find repugnant; especially that we should have some special status compared to the rest of the animal world. I'm not saying killing a human is comparable to killing a sheep, only that the moral grounds must be sought elsewhere. Interestingly the great moral philosopher Immanuel Kant only accepted the moral argument as "proof" for gods existence, while denying the cosmological, ontological and teleological proofs given by earlier philosophers. I also want to point out that while I can't endorse the idea of afterlife for humans I do respect believers trying to make the world a better place based on their beliefs. So there is no equivalence between bad ideas held by people and well... bad people.

January 23rd, 2018, 04:34 PM	#1785
lip Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 239 Thanks: 26,142 Thanked 8,199 Times in 241 Posts	It's clear to me that my "hobby" comparison is way too harmless for the extreme and fanatic ways religion is used to bring death and destruction into the lives of others. But it's my main answer when somebody is asking me what religion means to me. I also have the luxury of living in a country where my only regular contact with religion is the sound of the church clock.

January 23rd, 2018, 06:48 PM	#1786
cyrax Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 358 Thanks: 50 Thanked 1,479 Times in 345 Posts	Seconded. Those ducking clocks. I hear them in my sleep

January 23rd, 2018, 10:19 PM	#1787
cicciobuki supermoderateur Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Belgium Posts: 24,366 Thanks: 157,817 Thanked 321,328 Times in 24,281 Posts	If church bells was the only thing religions would inconvenience us with, it would be a pretty decent world

January 23rd, 2018, 11:51 PM	#1788
limbodan Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Virgo Supercluster Posts: 368 Thanks: 3,910 Thanked 3,383 Times in 364 Posts	38% in U.S. still believe humans divinely created 6-10 thousand years ago. http://anonym.to/http://news.gallup....s-new-low.aspx How can this number still be this high? It's not like we Americans haven't had over a century to study/learn modern science. Shocking. Just shocking.

January 24th, 2018, 01:46 AM	#1789
Mister Fide Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Nearly there Posts: 892 Thanks: 23,075 Thanked 17,986 Times in 890 Posts	Yes i am an atheist.................God told me i was.

January 24th, 2018, 06:41 PM	#1790
kogi Cash Whore Poster Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Unfortunately, without the cash & the whoring Posts: 7,985 Thanks: 16,665 Thanked 268,677 Times in 7,809 Posts	An interesting thought is if God showed up in a physical presence (e.g. bearded old man or a flaming bush) and said I'm the solution to everything and your salvation. And you do indeed believe him to be the all-powerful God of Christianity or Islam. Would you submit to his authority! I would probably fall to hell for my pride.