Questions for our American friends

[winebeavis]

Originally Posted by Greenman

So who the heck is Cedric the Entertainer - I keep seeing that name is loads of films and I wonder why he doesn't use his real name?

I don't he'll be bothering you much anymore. His 15 minutes expired a while ago.

[bombermouse]

Originally Posted by Decadence

A factor gun control advocates hope is overlooked in the phrase "gun deaths" are suicides.. which account for nearly two-thirds of the gun deaths in America.

The actual number of gun homicides and drunken driving deaths are about equal (both around 11,000/year in a country of roughly 315,000,000 people).

For a more apples to apples comparison, the best estimates of gun owning households in the USA is 45% or 142 million citizens. The number of licensed drivers is 208 million.

[DTravel]

Freedom is dangerous.

[SanteeFats]

Originally Posted by DTravel

Freedom is dangerous.

So do you have an alternative?? Maybe China, Russia, socialism, dictatorship, I mean what do you propose sir??

[JJ3027]

Originally Posted by DTravel

Freedom is dangerous.

Freedom isn't free. It has to be earned and maintained...and the reason why we need our freedom needs to be passed to future generations.

[Faceman675]

Originally Posted by Decadence

A factor gun control advocates hope is overlooked in the phrase "gun deaths" are suicides.. which account for nearly two-thirds of the gun deaths in America.

The actual number of gun homicides and drunken driving deaths are about equal (both around 11,000/year in a country of roughly 315,000,000 people).

Another thing gun control advocates hope is over looked is the use of the term "homicide". Included in the 11000 are justifiable homicide (self defense and defense of others) and death at the hands of Law Enforcement (the vast, vast majority of which are justified) That leaves you with murders and accidental shootings. Even murders are not universally the same. If you look at murders you need to differentiate between victims. A large portion of murders are criminal vs criminal. Sorry but I won't allow gang on gang violence to be used as an excuse to violate my 2nd Amendment rights without pointing out that the actual number of innocent deaths caused by firearms is somewhere between 3 & 4 thousand a year. The number of innocent deaths by DUI are quit a bit larger, 3 to 4 times, than innocent deaths caused by firearms.

[knobby109]

Originally Posted by SanteeFats

So do you have an alternative?? Maybe China, Russia, socialism, dictatorship, I mean what do you propose sir??

Socialism and freedom aren't incompatible.By American standards many European nations are socialist yet their citizens are at least as free.More so if freedom includes the freedom not to have to worry about medical costs,adequate income and other things.

[Decadence]

Originally Posted by Faceman675

A large portion of murders are criminal vs criminal. Sorry but I won't allow gang on gang violence to be used as an excuse to violate my 2nd Amendment rights without pointing out that the actual number of innocent deaths caused by firearms is somewhere between 3 & 4 thousand a year.

Quite correct.. and the Fed's own data backs this up. I wasn't going to go here, but it is a valid point.

Example: The number one cause of death among black males aged 18-30 is murder. In over 90% of these instances (numbering 7000-8000 year according to the FBI) the perpetrator is another black male aged 18-30. Black lives matter? Seems to be another case of selective outrage as I've yet to see this wholesale slaughter of Americans be the catalyst that causes people to burn down / loot their own neighborhoods, prompts speeches by outraged race whores, or the creation of clever hashtags. I'm sure the fact that the murder weapons in these instances are all illegally obtained doesn't matter, either. Chicago is a prime example. Some of the toughest gun laws in the country haven't mattered as every week the body count continues to grow.

The data is out there. All you have to do is dig for it and read it in its raw form without the 'benefit' of it being packaged to support an agenda.

[Sam Spade]

No British parent has ever had to worry that when they kiss their children goodbye as they leave for school it may be the last time they see them alive, no Brit has ever thought that teachers need to be armed in order to protect the children from someone who has just gone over the edge.

I love America and Americans, I am engaged to an American, but I would never live there, I would not want to raise a family there, not just because my neighbour might be armed, but because of factors like health care, politics etc.

[Faceman675]

Originally Posted by Decadence

Quite correct.. and the Fed's own data backs this up. I wasn't going to go here, but it is a valid point.

Example: The number one cause of death among black males aged 18-30 is murder. In over 90% of these instances (numbering 7000-8000 year according to the FBI) the perpetrator is another black male aged 18-30. Black lives matter? Seems to be another case of selective outrage as I've yet to see this wholesale slaughter of Americans be the catalyst that causes people to burn down / loot their own neighborhoods, prompts speeches by outraged race whores, or the creation of clever hashtags. I'm sure the fact that the murder weapons in these instances are all illegally obtained doesn't matter, either. Chicago is a prime example. Some of the toughest gun laws in the country haven't mattered as every week the body count continues to grow.

The data is out there. All you have to do is dig for it and read it in its raw form without the 'benefit' of it being packaged to support an agenda.

Your right about the racial aspect but pointing it out during a discussion/debate of gun control only allows the liberals (not on this board, it is well moderated) to dismiss your points (no matter how valid) as being racist. I feel it is better to leave the 2 issues (race and gun control) separate.
I chose to refer to criminal vs criminal, gang vs gang, drug dealer vs drug dealer.

On a different board I was accused of being cold hearted because I would differentiate between innocent and not innocent murder victims. If I had pointed out that much of the gang on gang violence was largely within minority communities I would have been labeled a racist and any point I might make from there forward would be dismissed as the rantings of a racist loon. Unfortunately far, far too many on the left chose to follow the teachings of Saul Alinsky and when they find themselves on the wrong side of the facts revert to personal ad hominem attacks.