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May 29th, 2017, 05:10 PM | #41 | |
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When one has been through 12 years of Catholic school education, one is never free of the indoctrination. In any event, it does no harm to take out a little insurance in case there is something other than a new chance to work on our unresolved issues, or as you hope, oblivion. If you are right, it won't matter what the priest does. If my parents, grandparents, and all the good sisters, brothers, bishops, and priests are right, I don't want to be spending any more time in purgatory than necessary. (I find it impossible to believe that a just and loving God would allow any of his children to remain in everlasting torment. Although it would appear that many of our Muslim brothers are really working on getting some hot coals up their asses for awhile.) |
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May 29th, 2017, 05:24 PM | #42 | |
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It's just as likely (or improbable) that any 'God' is Christian-hating one rather than Pro-Christian and your belief will damn you rather than give you any salvation. |
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May 29th, 2017, 06:53 PM | #43 |
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Yeah ok Vince.
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May 29th, 2017, 08:31 PM | #44 | |
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IMO, the New Testament is pretty iffy, too. One of my big issues with these ancient religions is the barriers they create to genuine exploration of spiritual reality and responsible ethics and morals. |
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May 29th, 2017, 08:54 PM | #45 | |
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The archaeological evidence for the Bible is non-existent
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May 29th, 2017, 10:25 PM | #46 |
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Even that well-known work of fiction; the one that continually trips over its own contradictions; has many tales of this 'supreme being' causing untold suffering either to test its/his followers resolve, or just for fun; so why do they now wonder why it/he's still doing it?
Truth is that luck just wasn't on your side the day something nasty happened to you or your loved ones; or it was the result of some nutter doing it as a result of another false religious belief; rather than it being the 'will' of some supreme being....? This is why I shall remain forever free of any faith, as much as people have tried to sway me in the past many many times.
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May 30th, 2017, 03:53 AM | #47 | ||||
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Extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence.
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May 31st, 2017, 05:05 AM | #48 | ||||
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Let me start out by saying that it is a much a hope as an opinion. I really hope to have the opportunity to use lessons learned through a succession of painful experiences. Aristotle stated at the conclusion of Posterior Analytics that all knowledge is based on intuition. IMO, all of our experience and/or knowledge is subjective in the final analysis. Do you have anything genuinely verifiable that objective knowledge can exist? My subjective reasons for believing reincarnation may be true are 1) experiences that suggested encounters in past lives and memories thereof, and 2) Plato and several Eastern religions attest to that reality. Quote:
Naturally, if this is indeed the special ed planet, all of us here are a very long way from enlightenment. Quote:
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I know I owe you an a promised PM. It has been on my mind of late. Life has been quite a struggle for quite awhile now, but hopefully I can get the PM out to you in the next few days. |
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May 31st, 2017, 07:00 PM | #49 | |||||||||||||||
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What distinguishes a genuinely plausible 'explanation' from a claim or a hope or a belief?
Thanks for taking the time answering my comments Brian, here are the questions I'm left with on hearing your thoughts:
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W: Why do you think that people once thought that they could see the sun go around the earth? S: Well I suppose it's because that's what it looks like. W: But does it? - Then how would a static sun appear when observed from the surface of an immense spinning sphere? i.e. If we assume in advance we know the nature of what reality has to be like we may very well be in danger of making the error of 'projecting' our evidence free assumption onto what we think 'reality' is & consequently create a self induced delusion based on what you assumed to be the case unconsciously (or consciously) in advance - without good, independently verifiable evidence for your assumption. Quote:
OK thanks Brian I look forward to it! Last edited by howerd; June 1st, 2017 at 10:24 PM.. |
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June 2nd, 2017, 06:45 AM | #50 | |
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I believe in the existence of a spiritual being present in the universe because I have had multiple occasions of experiencing that presence over many years. You are convinced that I am delusional. I really don't see how you can judge my experience given that you haven't had my experience, but that's OK. I am perfectly fine with you believing whatever you want as long as you follow our customary and legal agreements that each of us is free to believe whatever we want as long as we don't infringe on others rights. (Which is why so many of us strongly dislike fundamentalist Christians and those Muslims who seek to impose their habits and medieval values on us.) The Special Ed Planet, frankly I thought the complete range of this lady's belief was absolutely bonkers, but adopted the special ed planet hypothesis because it appeals to my sense of humor and deflates my ego. I often struggle with being a know-it-all, and am grateful for reminders of my fallibility (even if they do usually really piss me off at first.) David Hume in Treatise of Human Nature proceeded to demolish pretty much all claims to knowledge and even common claims to personal identity. He then proceeded to advise embracing custom as the best guide to behavior. After a lifetime of studying ethics and morals, I agree with Hume's notion that ethics and morals are grounded in our relationships with each other and have nothing to to do with God. Since I have an experience of the reality of the Divine, I would like to explore the whole question of theology free of the baggage of a dozen years of Catholic schooling, but recognize that Aquinas' framework is too deeply embedded to do so. Besides, Thomas Aquinas was a really deep and profound thinker and needs to be respected. Anyway, that's enough for now. I've gone on too long already. |
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