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Old 03-13-2018, 10:56 PM   #1941
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Pretty much the same argument creationists use to deny the existence of Evolution.

Not really, they just say it's not in the Bible so it cannot be true
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Old 03-13-2018, 11:16 PM   #1942
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Not really, they just say it's not in the Bible so it cannot be true
Other folk say the same about the Koran.
It's all BS, except for evidence that suggests God(s) exist, but not the one(s) we think.
Maybe, in 1000 years or more, we'll actually be able to "talk" to these things, and I'm pretty sure most folk won't like what "they've" got to "say", me being a firm believer in Murphy's Law, and all, heck its worse than that, maybe they've been talking to us from the word go, and we just twist their "words" into preconceived pictures of the world.
"God" says "Be careful with sharp edges, you might cut yourself" and we make swords to cut each other.

The only true laws of God(s) are the ones that cannot be disobeyed with impunity, like the law of gravity: "If you jump of a cliff, you will die"
Now, the man may not die for a few minutes, if he jumps from high enough.
There are, IMHO, other laws that we can disobey, on the short term, like "Don't lie, cheat, steal, commit extortion, etc" that, when disobeyed will also result in death, in fact, potentially millions of them.

The secular interpretation is "We are Apex predators, so we must be very, very careful."
The Christian interpretation is "We are Created in God's image, but are fallen."
I'm sure there are other interpretations of our position based on other theological viewpoints, but I concentrated on math and physics, and as such, will revel in my ignorance of them, and claim that I KNOW ALL!!!
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Old 03-14-2018, 03:41 AM   #1943
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It's all BS, except for evidence that suggests God(s) exist, but not the one(s) we think.
It seems to me you are confusing evidence with conjecture.
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Old 03-14-2018, 03:55 AM   #1944
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It seems to me you are confusing evidence with conjecture.
It is no more conjecture than the existence of anti-matter, neutrinos or quarks was.
The equations and observations speak for themselves.
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Old 03-14-2018, 04:01 AM   #1945
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It is no more conjecture than the existence of anti-matter, neutrinos or quarks was.
The equations and observations speak for themselves.
Exactly, we have observed anti-matter, neutrinos and quarks. They are no longer theoretical constructs like the god(s) you are suggesting we have evidence for.
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Old 03-14-2018, 04:08 AM   #1946
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Exactly, we have observed anti-matter, neutrinos and quarks. They are no longer theoretical constructs like the god(s) you are suggesting we have evidence for.
We have not observed evolution, biogenesis, or the inflaton field particle quantum, but we still know they exist, just like we knew the Higg's field particle quantum existed.

General Relativity + Quantum mechanics + Experimentally proven fact that the universe has a positive cosmological constant + Experimentally proven fact that far-from-equilibrium systems give rise to increasingly complex dissipative structures all adds up to God(s) or Boltzmann brains, and statistically, God(s) is far more likely.
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Old 03-14-2018, 04:21 AM   #1947
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We have not observed evolution,
Yes, we have.

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just like we knew the Higg's field particle quantum existed.
We didn't "know" it until it was demonstrated to exist. Before that, it was a theoretical construct that most physicists agreed was likely to exist.

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General Relativity + Quantum mechanics + Experimentally proven fact that the universe has a positive cosmological constant + Experimentally proven fact that far-from-equilibrium systems give rise to increasingly complex dissipative structures all adds up to God(s) or Boltzmann brains, and statistically, God(s) is far more likely.
Conjecture, not evidence.
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Old 03-14-2018, 05:19 AM   #1948
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I bet somewhere the artist formerly known as God is having a good chuckle to itself
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Old 03-14-2018, 08:14 AM   #1949
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A quote from a movie....
Bethany: Sex is a joke in heaven?

Metatron: The way I understand it, it's mostly a joke down here, too.
Well if all laughing causally at that then the adult humor is those of us masturbating to,...Just myself as a example. I can not call my favorite model a perfect Goddess/Aphrodite without believing, gotta get some laughs in heaven for that. I might be her punishment for her erotic exposure sins, then again I might have to answer to her for lusting her...Some how I think I her and I could win either way, she will get my worship. Then again I might have to clip her toenails for eternity, not so bad.
I like to think there is something to put comparison to.
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Old 09-15-2018, 12:49 PM   #1950
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My theology or lack thereof has evolved a lot through my life. My degrees are in philosophy and theology and I'm a former minister. At very least, I've lng held that all "revealed" or traditional narrative God-language is myth and metaphor, and don't consider faith to be a virtue. I'll still identify as a Christian, my cultural and family roots being important to me, but speak in terms of "faith heritage" rather than "faith."

I guess I'm kind of a schizotheist--if Thomas Aquinas and Richard Dawkins had a baby, it would probably be me. From what was once a robust faith in all the fairy tale stuff, what keeps me from identifying as atheist is pretty much just that the concept of primary causality still has a grip on me. I once thought that was totally compelling; its now downgraded to simply credible. I'm still trying to wrap my mind on the idea of cause and effect themselves being emergent properties, as maintained by Sean Carroll, but I'm not quite there yet. That would be a game changer if I were.
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