Communism. Good or bad. What do you really know about Communism?

[deepsepia]

Originally Posted by Enrico32

I don't get your preoccupation with Marx. The tread's about communism. Communism is as ancient as humanity. Some trace it back to the Apostolic creed (Christian communism)..

There's gotta be some kind of award for chutzpah, and if there is, that's the winner.

"My preoccupation with Marx"?

Communists talk about Marx morning, noon and night. They fly giant red flags with his face on it. He's on their currency. They write endless books about him

Communism in the political economic sense that we understand it today is not "as ancient as humanity" -- and for your "Christian communism" -- check in with Emperor Constantine, 'cuz I'm pretty sure that he was keen on the "render unto Caesar" bit . . .

Every single communist party that has achieved political power in the 20th century looked to Marx as an inspiration. Every one of them.

[Estreeter]

Originally Posted by bowlinggreen

I wonder how long he'd last in a Soviet steel foundry?

A long time actually
He'd be the union delegate who does no actual physical work, you know, handing out leaflets and so on

[bowlinggreen]

Originally Posted by Estreeter

A long time actually
He'd be the union delegate who does no actual physical work, you know, handing out leaflets and so on

I have said before he'd make a good Squealer, in the context of animal farm. All talk and no work.



Problem is, he's just not very convincing.

[Roubignol]

Originally Posted by Enrico32

Hi Xyz, what do you think of Ochs and La Harpe?

That Swiss ceased to be free-commune-dwellers and got a centralist country styled after Napoleonic France?

If I told you they both are almost unknown in Switzerland.
The Swiss heroes are : Arnold von Winkelried, Arnold von Melchtal, Walter Fürst, Werner Stauffacher and the mythic "Wilhelm Tell" (who maybe never existed ).

Mainly pure revolutionary farmers, who represent in Swiss spirit, fair hard workers who fought against overlords and won.

Originally Posted by bowlinggreen

Problem is, he's just not very convincing.

I always suspected that my mission would be almost impossible to convert classical Anglo-Saxon capitalist serfs to REAL freedom.

We, French speaking people, will always remember that our English cousins fought against us, because their monarchs gave them the order to defend their aristocratic privileges against notions like freedom, equality, fraternity.

If you think that I'll give up in front of your coalition, you are wrong.

I only have one thing to say: "La garde meurt, mais ne se rend pas."

[crinolynne]

Originally Posted by xyzde69

We, French speaking people, will always remember that our English cousins fought against us, because their monarchs gave them the order to defend their aristocratic privileges against notions like freedom, equality, fraternity.

You should sooooo not go there.

[bowlinggreen]

I always suspected that my mission would be almost impossible to convert classical Anglo-Saxon capitalist serfs to REAL freedom.

We, French speaking people, will always remember that our English cousins fought against us, because their monarchs gave them the order to defend their aristocratic privileges against notions like freedom, equality, fraternity.

I am not an Anglo-Saxon serf, I am an American. We threw off the yoke of evil monarchs long ago.

There is no king in a marble castle telling me how to live this evening, no communist dictator dwelling in an onion-domed edifice deciding whether I should live or die, only a somewhat deranged businessman in an oversized plantation house twittering about how we should do this or that. And we elected him (well, some of us did) to sit in that plantation house and troll people on Twitter. And he can't fuck with us in any real meaningful way, because we cleverly set up our government so that aristocrats, nobles, dictators and Swiss Savonarolas like you can't turn our happy republic into another steaming pile of shit.

We like things just as they are, thank you very much.

I am relatively free, all you have are fantasies of freedom, and truth be told, they aren't very good fantasies.

[Enrico32]

Originally Posted by xyzde69

If I told you they both are almost unknown in Switzerland.
Mainly pure revolutionary farmers, who represent in Swiss spirit, fair hard workers who fought against overlords and won.

But you eventually lost the traditional Amish-like commune way of life. In 19th century you received strong federals.

What's popular opinion on this?
Did centralism really stem from Swiss internal ideas (Rousseau) or was it really a result of conquest (by France and later victorious Allies)?

Could you (want you) abolish all notions of a country and go back to Tagsatzung era?

[deepsepia]

Originally Posted by xyzde69

I only have one thing to say: "La garde meurt, mais ne se rend pas."

Well, that was the motto of an Army brigade pledged to the service of a tyrant, so its a fine citation for a Stalinist . . .

It funny that you namecheck the folks who put an end to the Revolution-- you forget that Napoleon thought of the revolutionaries as canaille and famously disposed of the Directory in the coup Brumaire, and a few years later crowned himself Emperor.

[Estreeter]

Originally Posted by bowlinggreen

That's a rather unfair accusation. The mods here are pretty darn good

Forgot to thank you for that the other night , so Thanks
I got way to angry the other night and couldn't reply without being abusive, tried posting a proper reply but just couldn't, so waited.

What annoyed me was xyzde stated I manipulate .... without any evidence, there have been a few post removals, but that's it, I'd like to ask him why he thinks I do and back it up with evidence He'd only come up with, I don't know what actually, maybe he could help me

Today, I hate Communism more than I did yesterday also

[Roubignol]

Originally Posted by bowlinggreen

I am not an Anglo-Saxon serf, I am an American. We threw off the yoke of evil monarchs long ago.

Your monarchs wear no crown today, but they still are monarchs and sometimes are worse than fair monarchs.

Originally Posted by bowlinggreen

There is no king in a marble castle telling me how to live this evening, no communist dictator dwelling in an onion-domed edifice deciding whether I should live or die, only a somewhat deranged businessman in an oversized plantation house twittering about how we should do this or that. And we elected him (well, some of us did) to sit in that plantation house and troll people on Twitter. And he can't fuck with us in any real meaningful way, because we cleverly set up our government so that aristocrats, nobles, dictators and Swiss Savonarolas like you can't turn our happy republic into another steaming pile of shit.

We like things just as they are, thank you very much.

I am relatively free, all you have are fantasies of freedom, and truth be told, they aren't very good fantasies.

I only think that Neoliberalism is a catastrophy and Capitalism pushs to Neoliberalism.
The new monarchs is a cast of plutocrats collaborating with bankers and financial institutes.

If you (as myself) are not in the lowest casts and quite glad in our societies, that doesn't mean we don't have to point the problems.

Didn't you observe that the "highest cast" still impose an economic system that is incredibly harmful for the next generation?
Just read scientific reports. Reports pointed that at least since 1970. What were the resolutions taken by our governements when reading these reports?
None. They have pushed people to waste more energy than ever, to went on war to occupy Middle East to steal their oil.... etc...

Today people could easily work 15 hours per week (and more if they wanted), have simple hobbies instead to produce craps or working in offices to write paperworks.
We could better share jobs more.

Don't you occult the reality ?