Things Noticeable this week

[Puhbear69]

Originally Posted by Nobody1

A few remarks on economic development in both German states. Let's start in the post-war period. The initial conditions for both states could not be more different.


The DDR was the only German state that paid war reparations to the destroyed Soviet Union. The reparations consisted amongst other things of the few undestroyed industrial facilities in eastern Germany, which were dismantled and rebuilt in the Soviet Union. After the war, the DDR had to create almost everything out of thin air, while the West German economy was able to grow fat under the safe umbrella of the Marshall Plan and the London Agreement. Both enabled the so-called Wirtschaftswunder of the post war peroid in the western part of Germany.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/London...External_Debts

We must pay particular attention to the fact that East Germany was, and still is, a predominantly agricultural shaped region with very little industry. It was the dominion of the so-called Landjunker.

https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ostelbien

The DDR was thus at a historical disadvantage from the outset since the industrial and financial centers were located almost exclusively in the western part of our country. Supported by a partner who stinks of money and whose homeland was not destroyed by the war. Nevertheless, the economic growth of both German states was comparable during the post war years. Which is a quite considerable achievement, if you ask me.

Let us now come to the time of reunification. Almost all companies of the East German industrial sector were wantonly destroyed after the reunification in order to secure market shares for Western competitors. Responsible for this was the so-called Treuhandanstalt.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treuhandanstalt

East German companies and corporations were sometimes sold off to western interest groups for just one Mark. Some were restructuring cases, some were not. But in almost every case there were subsidy fraud. State subsidies which were intended for the restoration of East German companies were redirected, and flowed straight into sugar-coated balance sheets of the Western enterprises that had bought them. To the general joy of their shareholders. A good example of such cheap trickery is the Warnow shipyard in Warnemünde, Mecklenburg-Vorpommern.

https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warnowwerft_Warnemünde

This is just one example among many. The East German companies were gutted and abandoned. They went bankrupt and their workers and employees became unemployed. Some of them sought a new existence in the West, but most were too old for a change of location. This led to the next problem. The over-aging population. Merkel tries to counteract this self-inflicted demographic problem by the politically desired settlement of war refugees. And this leads to another problem. The political revival of right-wing extremism in Germany.

The partly rotten industry in East Germany can not be denied. There were also numerous environmental issues. All that is true. But I saw these conditions in the West as well. Keyword 'ThyssenKrupp'. And we never poisoned our cities with lead water, or buried nuclear waste unprotected in ground water flooded salt mines. I live now for almost 30 years in the Ruhr area and know what I'm talking about.

https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atommülllager_Gorleben

The 'totally rotten industry' of East Germany, however, is just a cheap (but very popular) Propaganda fairytale. You can easily recognize this by the simple fact that much of the Western goods were produced in the East, for example, the predominant part of all catalog goods. The labor costs were more favorable, which, of course, represented a competitive advantage. A detailed balance sheet on that subject is accessible in the final report of the German Bundesbank on the German unification of 1999. I'm too lazy at the moment to look for it, sorry. You can google yourself if you want to find it.

The Schwermaschinenbau-Kombinat 'Ernst Thälmann' in Magdeburg, whose modernization was completed just before the German reunification, was then one of the most modern machine building companies in Europe. SKET is still alive and kicking. One of the few lucky bunnies that have escaped the economic carnage after the reunification.

https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schwer...hälmann“

Btw, the company where I completed my professional training was very well equipped. We had everything we needed to produce our goods (heavy machinery) for international markets according to applicable norms and quality standards.

At first:
I mentioned in my post more the infrastructure as the East German companies.

The money exchange the citizens got was 1:1 (to a limit of 20.000 GDR- Marks, I think).
The real money exchange has been 1:3 to 1:4 !!!

The traditional markets of the GDR was broken away, because most of the Eastern countries were bankrupt too, special the former Soviet Union. Those counties were not able to pay tor their imported goods in 1989 to 1991.

True is too, a lot of Western selling companies produced in the East, special I think (from a good- to a cheap quality) clothing or (cheap-) furniture.
After the German reunion they lost their interest because of the exchange.

The very most GDR companies (I think about >95%) was belonging the state and not in private hands. The very most of the former CEO were politically burdened, got as "Vitamin -B" (for the English: the term stands in German for "Beziehungen" = "ties") to the SED in their jobs. Not all of them, of course!
The German government -with a very few exceptions- is usually leading no companies nor it's having the capacity to do so. Also the EU is demands it, no governmentally companies.
So the "Treuhand" was created to sell those companies belonging to the state.
A lot went wrong by the activities by the Treuhand, there was a lot of corruption and/or simply inability in their activities during that period.
So far I'm d'accord with 'Nobody1' or 'Brecht'.

But one has to consider: it wasn't just one company - but a lots of and it, and gave in the history no example, that a state had to sell lots of companies to private hands.

That's not the trial of an excuse for the Treuhand but a description of the situation to make this understandable. A lot of it could have run better, I agree. But there has been no example in history, one could follow or was warned to follow the way.

And true too, meanwhile those companies couldn’t pay their workers and it gave a lot of job cuts. The German state had the alternative: to let them produce products on, no one wants to have just for the "trash box" or let them go into the classic joblessness (what's here not so catastrophically like for example in the US for example). What had been better - who knows.

An good example is the former GDR flagship-company "Robotron" with 68.000 workers. They produced computers an other electronic products for the Eastern markets. But those products were at least ten years behind Western standards what means at last: "Stone age computers" and not compatible.
Only 5% of the workers could be integrated in following companies, unfortunately.

But yes, some of the companies were definitely worth of preservation, but if no one wanted to buy and pay for the workers than - what would you do.

[Greenman]

Thought it was rather odd on The One Show for Jason Bateman to ask whether we celebrate 4th July...err well no Jase because it is against us and the oppression by the King that you have it so we are hardly likely to celebrate something like that although people still eat burgers etc. We have St George's Day anyway if anyone can actually remember that is our sort of national day.

Not been around for a while due to the intense warmth of the attic and then my PC playing up every night so reduced to using IPad for now or laptop- mind you it seems no-one noticed I wasn't around anyway 😊

[Devius]

Heard on BBC News:
Spam turns 80 years old today...

Details:
http://www.cleveland.com/entertainme...am_on_its.html

All together now:

"Spam, Spam, Spam, Spam, Spammity Spam, Wonderful Spam."

[Rogerbh]

[Rogerbh]

I am glad the SBS wasn't in existence during the American Revolutionary War.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/392795...ps-mosul-iraq/

[mizlaplan]

I'd like to wish our American members belated independence day congratulations:
Happy Fifth of July!

[otokonomidori]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-40428976

Saw this article about sex robots on the BBC news site.

[Rogerbh]

Originally Posted by otokonomidori

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-40428976

Saw this article about sex robots on the BBC news site.

I don't think I understand the legalities of this article. A robot that looks like a little kid is illegal to have because of pedophile laws? The robot is not real. It is not a picture of some little kid being abused. So if you have a model of a nuclear bomb you will be convicted of having a destructive device?

Isn't this overstepping the bounds of what is legal and illegal?

So what if he inserts his dick into a robot that looks like a little kid, it isn't a human.

We going to arrest people for buying cantaloupes under the belief that they are going to have sex with it thinking it is a little kid? Jeez!

[diamelsx]

Originally Posted by mizlaplan

I'd like to wish our American members belated independence day congratulations:
Happy Fifth of July!

And on that note let me go get a fifth of Bombay Sapphire

[Rogerbh]

The family should have been allowed to beat him until they were satisfied.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/26-old-ma...131000062.html


Why you would do this to a 1 year old is beyond me. If he was executed I would have no problem with it.