"The Unexplainable...."

[cidron]

Originally Posted by vinceprince

I know it's pushing it to expect an explanation on a porn forum, but where did all the material for the Big Bang come from?

The big bang theory is a man-made metaphor created for the masses to answer the unanswerable: how does something come from nothing? In a billion years, our descendants will be able to frame the question more intelligently, but they will not be able to answer it. We are not supposed to know the answer.

-- David Hume

[electile disfunction]

Originally Posted by vinceprince

I know it's pushing it to expect an explanation on a porn forum, but where did all the material for the Big Bang come from?

The short answer is:
That material is the Big Bang. All that existed before the BB was a "nothing that contained potential" that ultimately erupted everything that is our universe.

Um, it might help to imagine yourself being extremely small--say about ten times the size of an electron--and while wandering about you observe an electron and a positron (an "anti-electron" particle) spontaneously 'appear' or 'erupt' in front of you out of nothing. What you have just witnessed is an much smaller version of the initial Big Bang event where our universe spontaneously came into existence from and of nothing.

Of course, what has happened since the BB and what types of matter and physical constants appeared when quickly becomes very complex and is the foundation of many a PhD thesis.
For example, our electron and positron from above could re-crash together back into nothing, they could fly apart and enter some stable relationships with other particles in the universe, could crash into and obliterate other matter here, or could perhaps move on to telling their sordid stories on the Nuclear Springer Show and then slowly degenerating into a social heat-death after their 15 micro-minutes of celebrity ...

( I think I digressed a bit there.) Did that short explanation and the examples help at all?

e.d.

[electile disfunction]

Originally Posted by cidron

The big bang theory is a man-made metaphor created for the masses to answer the unanswerable: how does something come from nothing? In a billion years, our descendants will be able to frame the question more intelligently, but they will not be able to answer it. We are not supposed to know the answer.

-- David Hume

David Hume was extremely brilliant but I don't recall him ever mentioning anything about the Big Bang. Where did you get this quote from, please?

e.d.

[Estreeter]

Originally Posted by vinceprince

I know it's pushing it to expect an explanation on a porn forum, but where did all the material for the Big Bang come from?

I'm sure I saw a documentary on National Geographic that explained that the big bang is the exact opposite too a nuclear explosion, where in a nuclear explosion matter is converted too pure energy and in the big bang pure energy was converted to matter.

Don't know how factual that is, but sounded good enough too me when having a bottle of whiskey at the time

[cidron]

Originally Posted by electile disfunction

David Hume was extremely brilliant but I don't recall him ever mentioning anything about the Big Bang. Where did you get this quote from, please?

e.d.

It is not a David Hume quote. It is my observation. David Hume is one of the brilliant philosophers who inspire me. -- David Hume is intended as a title for his image in case someone does not recognize him. I probably did not need to title his image as most people are able to recognize him. Thanks for the heads up. I will either title images without dashes or leave them untitled.

[electile disfunction]

Originally Posted by cidron

Seeking clarification on the Atomic Theory. Do atoms, electrons, protons, neutrons, quarks, etc. actually exist? Or are they a man-made metaphor designed to describe the attractive and repulsive forces (electro magnetism) that hold physical matter together? Linus?

I am not sure that I understand what you are asking as you seem to have answered yourself. (Perhaps you are not sure of what you wish to ask?)

Since Linus has been dead for some time, I'll try to address some of what you said but I would greatly appreciate some clarification from you afterward.

Matter exists--you used your fingers (they are easily recognizable matter) or voice to transcribe your question into a computer (easily recognizable matter) and I suspect that you were sitting at the time, and you are perceiving some sort of monitor (easily recognizable matter) to read this answer. All of those things (including your bottom that you sat on) are matter. That you can physically experience these things proves that they are more than a metaphor.

Also, people have shown that atoms make up that matter and that those atoms have real existence as discrete, quantifiable pieces. (Tap your keyboard again, is it still there?)

Also, we know that the basic constituents of that matter--protons, neutrons, electrons--and their opposites exist. If for some reason "they" don't exist then there are other particles that do exist that are very, very much like our models and understanding.

Etc., etc., ad absurdum.

Another difficulty: Electro-magnetism is only one observable characteristic of matter and it is only observable in small percentage of interactions within all matter at any given moment. Other characteristics include (but are not limited to) energy, space-time, gravity, strong and weak nuclear forces, etc. Without matter as we understand it, these characteristics wouldn't exist either. (For example, if you did not exist your post on this thread would not exist ... )

The "metaphor(s)" you speak of is the biggest mystery to me. Are you refering to a philosophical or theological perspective, perhaps? Or some linguistic, psychological, social or cultural understanding maybe?

Please reply soon!
e.d.

[electile disfunction]

Originally Posted by mvasilj

... Don't know how factual that is, but sounded good enough too me when having a bottle of whiskey at the time

There is so much about people, life, and the universe that more understandable when drinking. Pliny the Elder called this phenomenon in vino veritas: "in wine there is truth".

Whatever helps ...
e.d.

[cidron]

Originally Posted by electile disfunction

The "metaphor(s)" you speak of is the biggest mystery to me. Are you refering to a philosophical or theological perspective, perhaps? Or some linguistic, psychological, social or cultural understanding maybe?

Please reply soon!
e.d.

A response that intelligently clarifies my positions will require some time.

[dohupa]

Why did they call it Big Bang anyway? Subatomic particles having a gang bang party eh?

[vinceprince]

Originally Posted by electile disfunction

The short answer is:
That material is the Big Bang. All that existed before the BB was a "nothing that contained potential" that ultimately erupted everything that is our universe.

Um, it might help to imagine yourself being extremely small--say about ten times the size of an electron--and while wandering about you observe an electron and a positron (an "anti-electron" particle) spontaneously 'appear' or 'erupt' in front of you out of nothing. What you have just witnessed is an much smaller version of the initial Big Bang event where our universe spontaneously came into existence from and of nothing.

Of course, what has happened since the BB and what types of matter and physical constants appeared when quickly becomes very complex and is the foundation of many a PhD thesis.
For example, our electron and positron from above could re-crash together back into nothing, they could fly apart and enter some stable relationships with other particles in the universe, could crash into and obliterate other matter here, or could perhaps move on to telling their sordid stories on the Nuclear Springer Show and then slowly degenerating into a social heat-death after their 15 micro-minutes of celebrity ...

( I think I digressed a bit there.) Did that short explanation and the examples help at all?

e.d.

Thanks, I can buy the something from nothing hypothesis on a single subatomic level, but to build a whole universe from nothing doesn't it require an equal loss of material say from something like a super black hole?

Maybe this is just beyond my caveman-like brain.