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Old 11-18-2015, 02:01 AM   #24221
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Originally Posted by Dave998 View Post
Interesting info, Mr. Fats, and I am not familiar with that book or its authors. My little short list of Christians and others behaving badly, however, listed quite a few bloody activities that are not considered to be wars at all, but the victims are just as dead anyway. I know that WW II is not called a religious war by that book, so I guess the 6 million Jews killed by the Nazis are to be considered to be collateral damage, including all of my father's kin who had not previously come to the USA. I guess my point is that religion-based persecution, discrimination, and prejudices are all harmful -often deadly - without wars per se, and I stand by my dislike of ALL theocrats as enemies of freedom.
I hope you won't construe this as an attack on your counter-point, but rather as an expansion upon the dangers of theocracy as the dark side of religions' hold on people.
I do not take it as an attack. WWI, WWII, Stalin, Mao, and many others were not religious wars. They were the results of political decisions. The Jews as an example were used as scapegoats to focus the hate on a target group. Just like the gypsies. Stalin and Mao were not religious but murdered all those millions to remove dissidents and perceived enemies. In their case religious groups were just a side show for this. Ad nausea.
As to theocratic rule I totally agree. When a nation has a religion for its laws and/or the right to rule comes from a God it is a theocracy. Nazi Germany was not theocratic. Nor the others I mentioned.
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Old 11-18-2015, 04:09 AM   #24222
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Originally Posted by palo5 View Post
....But in the age of science and the refrigerator, we understand more. So I can respect the origin of the law, but keeping the tradition doesn't make sense to me
Amen, brother. Hey Palo, pass me that hot steamed rice and some of that sweet and sour sauce will ya?


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Old 11-18-2015, 04:22 AM   #24223
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Originally Posted by gordian_knot View Post
That's true, but there's only one religion today whose adherents create terror and cause mayhem around the world in its name, and that's Islam.
No it isn't. Pretty much every religion has violent fringe elements. Even the Buddhists if you ask the Chinese.
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Old 11-18-2015, 12:06 PM   #24224
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Turkey fans boo minute's silence for Paris victims


http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/...7oWDqp3c3g0.97


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/foo...-Istanbul.html


Must be all those "fringe" Buddhists.
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Old 11-18-2015, 12:33 PM   #24225
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Originally Posted by vannax View Post
Turkey fans boo minute's silence for Paris victims


http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/...7oWDqp3c3g0.97


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/foo...-Istanbul.html


Must be all those "fringe" Buddhists.
No just moronic football hooligans I'm afraid. Boos of just a few dozen or hundred are very easy to hear during a minute silence. For that reason in the last 10 years English clubs have changed it to a minute of applause to drown out the minority of idiots who would boo or shout abuse.

Football 'supporters' all over the sing moronic songs about tragic events that have happened to their rivals. In Italy rivals of Juventus sing songs celebrating the deaths that happened at Heysel. Rangers and Celtic fans still sing sectarian songs celebrating atrocities.

So I guess they're Christians as much as those guys in Turkey are Muslims.
But it's only football this happens, seems to be the sport that appeals to the moronic fringe of all religious and non-religious sports fans.
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Old 11-18-2015, 12:53 PM   #24226
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Originally Posted by vinceprince View Post
No just moronic football hooligans I'm afraid. Boos of just a few dozen or hundred are very easy to hear during a minute silence. For that reason in the last 10 years English clubs have changed it to a minute of applause to drown out the minority of idiots who would boo or shout abuse.

Football 'supporters' all over the sing moronic songs about tragic events that have happened to their rivals. In Italy rivals of Juventus sing songs celebrating the deaths that happened at Heysel. Rangers and Celtic fans still sing sectarian songs celebrating atrocities.

So I guess they're Christians as much as those guys in Turkey are Muslims.
But it's only football this happens, seems to be the sport that appeals to the moronic fringe of all religious and non-religious sports fans.

I guess the yells of "Allah Akhbar" were just the same as the Christian hooligans here who are always yelling "Jesus Saves" at football games.
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Old 11-18-2015, 01:10 PM   #24227
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Originally Posted by vannax View Post
I guess the yells of "Allah Akhbar" were just the same as the Christian hooligans here who are always yelling "Jesus Saves" at football games.
I guess from that you've never been to an Old Firm game in Glasgow Vannax. It's less 'Jesus Saves' and more 'Fuck the Pope!'

Btw they yell 'Jesus Saves' at Levante in Spain. He's their Goalkeeper Jesús Fernández Collado, simply known as Jesús.

Last edited by vinceprince; 11-18-2015 at 01:55 PM..
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Old 11-18-2015, 10:50 PM   #24228
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It's like a bad Monty Python sketch:
"We did this because our holy texts exhort us to to do it."
"No you didn't."
"Wait, what? Yes we did..."
"No, this has nothing to do with religion. You guys are just using religion as a front for social and geopolitical reasons."
"WHAT!? Did you even read our official statement? We give explicit Quranic justification. This is jihad, a holy crusade against pagans, blasphemers, and disbelievers."
"No, this is definitely not a Muslim thing. You guys are not true Muslims, and you defame a great religion by saying so."
"Huh!? Who are you to tell us we're not true Muslims!? Islam is literally at the core of everything we do, and we have implemented the truest most literal and honest interpretation of its founding texts. It is our very reason for being."
"Nope. We created you. We installed a social and economic system that alienates and disenfranchises you, and that's why you did this. We're sorry."
"What? Why are you apologizing? We just slaughtered you mercilessly in the streets. We targeted unwitting civilians - disenfranchisement doesn't even enter into it!"
"Listen, it's our fault. We don't blame you for feeling unwelcome and lashing out."
"Seriously, stop taking credit for this! We worked really hard to pull this off, and we're not going to let you take it away from us."
"No, we nourished your extremism. We accept full blame."
"OMG, how many people do we have to kill around here to finally get our message across?"
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Old 11-19-2015, 03:52 PM   #24229
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Junior doctors row: 98% vote in favour of strikes
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-34859860

Militant little tossers

Junior doctors in England have overwhelmingly voted in favour of going on strike in their dispute with ministers over a new contract.
Some 98% voted in favour of a full strike and 99% in favour of action just short of a full strike.

As someone who was admitted to a hospital on a Friday the only doctors I saw were for two brief consultations then I was kept in over the weekend as there were no medical staff and on the Monday/Tuesday again I saw doctors for maybe 10 minutes max in total. There were no questions asked, I got bugger all information about my condition or what to expect during my recovery or any after effects.

I had to push myself so I could convince them to let me out of hospital and the experience left me with a very jaundiced view of large parts of the medical profession.
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Old 11-19-2015, 04:00 PM   #24230
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Originally Posted by Wendigo View Post
Junior doctors row: 98% vote in favour of strikes
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-34859860

Militant little tossers

Junior doctors in England have overwhelmingly voted in favour of going on strike in their dispute with ministers over a new contract.
Some 98% voted in favour of a full strike and 99% in favour of action just short of a full strike.

As someone who was admitted to a hospital on a Friday the only doctors I saw were for two brief consultations then I was kept in over the weekend as there were no medical staff and on the Monday/Tuesday again I saw doctors for maybe 10 minutes max in total. There were no questions asked, I got bugger all information about my condition or what to expect during my recovery or any after effects.

I had to push myself so I could convince them to let me out of hospital and the experience left me with a very jaundiced view of large parts of the medical profession.

Worth every penny, eh?
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