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Old 03-25-2017, 01:47 PM   #391
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Originally Posted by scoundrel View Post
The fat lady has not yet cleared her throat on this one. The Republicans have defeated themselves, showing how screwed up their heads are on healthcare. The Democrats have a more coherent line on healthcare and I strongly doubt if any deal involving the Demcrats will mean "repealing Obamacare". But if Mr Trump could present it as a reform of "Obamacare" to improve it and make it more sustainable, he could get somewhere. He is a Republican president but a lot of Republicans do not support him (as the healthcare vote failure demonstrates) and a lot of Trump supporters do not have much time for the Republican Party. For Mr Trump to outflank his Republican opponents and do a deal with the Democrats would be a slap in the face for many of the House Republicans, but a well deserved one and one which a lot of Trump voters would enjoy.
He won't achieve anything else he plans if he alienates those fiscal conservatives. Many of them are not fans of expensive walls or religious discrimination.

The whole point of the legislation was to save about $900 billion of Gov't money which Trump/Ryan could use to give away to the better off in Tax Cuts. But he's still going ahead with the Tax Cuts without any way of paying for it apart from greater debt?
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Old 03-25-2017, 02:32 PM   #392
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Repealing the ACA was THE key piece of legislation that Republican's have been promising for 7 years. Without it's repeal they can not go forward on their agenda as they intended, to reallocate the funding from the ACA to other areas, like tax cuts for the 1% and corporations. This is a major failure. It wont be admitted as major, but it is.

Perhaps, instead of taking a photo op behind the wheel of a truck, the president should have been spending his time working to get his promised legislation actually through congress. Dazzle us with your work ethic, Donald, if you possess one. Roll up your sleeve's and dive right in to the difficult work ahead. Leave the photo op's for your weekends, when you're golfing at Mar A Largo.
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Old 03-25-2017, 03:03 PM   #393
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Originally Posted by ConstantOgler View Post
This seems a thoughtful, logical statement that no one can dispute. And = is being said by many people. But for me there is a hole in the very center of it. Words like "cooperation . . .collusion . . influence . . . interference . . subversion" etc are being spun by partisans at high speed, like electrons or planets, as if this will prove there is something real at the center. Or maybe obscure the fact there isn't anything at all. ?

No one here, and no objective person anywhere, doubts Hillary's loss was caused by her own inept campaign and the peculiar role of the electoral college. How did Russians cause either of these? Well then, is this about something other than Hillary losing?

Very interesting you cite the revelation about DNC tilt against Bernie. Surely this was most significant result of the hacking. But, is that what cost HRC the election? It did not cost her the Dem nomination! So, if you are a Dem, your case for impeach Trump is that independent voters so resented how your party gave her the nom, they voted Trump? Have fun with that! . . . Got anything else?

Indeed, as Lady Luck has posted, the basic problem with any and all these "Russian Influence" claims is that they involve voters being made aware of facts. How the facts were obtained and even if they are dubious will always be peripheral issues in a free speech country.
As Bernie said to Hillary, about being tired of hearing about her damn emails, I'm tired of hearing about Russian hacking. I actually trust the institutions separate from Trump and the president in general. If there's anything "there" in regards to Russia, they'll bring it to light or it'll leak, or someone will find it. Eventually. Trust. If there's nothing concrete, oh well. I personally never made a big deal of it.

Here's the thing with the leaks on Hillary though. If we're talking about the main source of Hillary's leaks, Wikileaks, well then Wikileaks was nefariously one-sided. Make of THAT what you want, but I think it's fair to say. I would have LOOOVED to see some of the things released about Hillary, released about Trump as well. I mean, besides some silly tape of him using the P-word. I'm talking income sources, business dealings, etc. What actually matters when you're a president. Wikileaks unearthed the DNC's (unsurprising) fact that the establishment didn't want a SOCIALIST! The establishment felt Trump would have trounced Bernie, and I agree he would have. Savage560s wouldn't allow a socialist in America. You crazy! The United States, as a whole, is still deathly afraid of anything they perceive as socialism or communism. I'm not saying illegal, or even legal, shenanigans are fair, but no one's playing fair, like it or not, this is politics in America. The Republicans didn't want Trump either, I'm sure the RNC, and the Republican establishment in general was cooking up some deviancy behind closed doors, only for them it backfired. Anyone remember what the establishment tried to do, and did do, to maverick McCain back in 2000 when he was beating Bush? You know, when Trump was a progressive and no one took his Reform party run seriously. Oh, 2000. The signs you gave us.

In terms of Hillary's "inept" campaign (what she WAS able to get in terms of votes was not inept by the way, people just dislike her, can't help that), to reiterate a previous point I've made, I truly feel Trump was in a perfect position. 2016 was THE YEAR a slew of Americans were tired of politicians and political correctness (especially in the states needed for the E.C.), and Trump was the de-facto (aka only) candidate for them on that front. How did Russians cause this? They didn't. They helped though. They nudged sentiments. With RT America and other such "mediums". They got the right by going all Alex Jones and got the left by going all Chris Hedges. What did they both have in common? Hillary. Their feelings towards Hillary. Only party-rigid Democrats TRULY, for realsies, supported Hillary. And yet, that said, she STILL got 65 million votes. And THAT said, TRUMP still got 62 million votes. How did BOTH of these miracles happen?! I thought less people would turn out, overall, given we had these two.

As per your third paragraph, ohhhhh, you'd be surprised. Did you not watch some of the hilarious protests outside some of Hillary's rallies with some signs like "EMAILS!", by the left mind you, in regards to the DNC emails (ironically a chant/tool by the right, but because of the email server issue) and "I'D RATHER VOTE TRUMP". But, no, who exactly made the case that THAT'S the reason for impeachment? Of course not. That's just ridiculous. That's a separate thing. People are coming up with a variety of reasons to impeach Trump, ranging from reasonable to asinine, but none of them have been, because the DEMS played tricks against Bernie, therefore the election is unfair.

BTW, can we all agree though how funny it is to see a reversal of the 80's, of who is now so patriotically against Russia, the way Reaganites and Republicans were so against the Soviets? And who is now accusing who of red scare tactics.gl
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Old 03-25-2017, 10:36 PM   #394
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Default 'Political Commisars'

Trump Said to Have Political Aides Monitoring the Loyalty of Cabinet Secretaries

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As President Trump recently reminded us, when someone has been disloyal to him, he never forgets it. But now that he’s president, it’s become more difficult to keep track of those who have defied him — or who may potentially defy him. That’s why, according to the Washington Post, Trump has embedded political appointees in every cabinet agency and tasked them with keeping tabs on the secretaries’ fealty to the president. Unsurprisingly, this is not going over well with some cabinet members.
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As New York’s Ed Kilgore noted last month, “People like that can be described as political commissars, to use the term made famous in the Soviet Union for the agents sent to impose ideological discipline, particularly in military units.” Sure enough, the former Marine and fighter pilot assigned to Defense Secretary Jim Mattis is privately referred to as “the commissar” within the Pentagon.
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Old 03-25-2017, 10:56 PM   #395
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I am waiting for a good deal of the Trump supporters to understand they have been conned...
I am currently looking for a writing credit from Bill for this segment here.
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Old 03-26-2017, 10:18 PM   #396
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Here's a picture of Mr Trump's committee dealing with healthcare. One of the items on the agenda was health services for women and weather mammograms should continue to be essential.

Can't quite put my finger on it, but one vital element seems to be missing from a committee deciding on women's issues.

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Old 03-26-2017, 11:21 PM   #397
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Default Trump’s ‘Art’ Didn’t Work on Failed AHCA Deal

Following the spectacular failure of the American Health Care Act, it’s now abundantly clear that President Trump’s first 100 days in office will almost certainly not include a significant legislative victory for him or the Republican Party, despite their rare control of Washington, or their repeated promises to get rid of Obamacare. Furthermore, a central, self-made myth about Trump — that he is a master deal-maker — seemed to evaporate when it came to negotiating legislation. Indeed, insider accounts suggest that Trump’s deal-making style likely hurt the AHCA more than it helped, as did his seeming lack of commitment to the actual process of policy-making and governing.

“Nobody knew healthcare could be so complicated,” Trump told a group of governors in February. A month later, when the president finally decided to embrace his role in the legislative process and try to whip up support for the AHCA bill, Trump deployed a messaging strategy that was light on substance, heavy on Trump. Rather than assuage the policy concerns of skeptical Republicans, Trump often bullied them instead, asking them how well he did in their districts and telling them how badly the bill’s failure might hurt them, and him, politically.

“Forget about the little shit,” Trump reportedly said to a group of 30 representatives who had come to the White House. “Let’s focus on the big picture here,” and by big picture Trump meant his reputation, his agenda, and his chances at reelection.

Motivated by the desire to win, perhaps exclusively, Trump was unable to address specific policy issues when talking with members of the House GOP or conservative groups, and was just trying to play — and enjoy — the role of closer. Trump “didn’t know, didn’t care, or both,” when it came to details, according to a congressional aide who spoke with CNN. A GOP congressman added that the president “did very little to say why we should vote ‘yes,’” and “kept talking about his damn election.”


Source:
http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer...ahca-deal.html

Bit too early to write off the Donald's 100 days just yet - there is still the tax reform...

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Old 03-26-2017, 11:44 PM   #398
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Default 'Nobody Knew Governing Could Be So Complicated'

To sort of piggy-back off Devius' post on the ACA vote, The Atlantic's got a piece on that, and I found this quote from Texas Republican representative Joe Barton telling and honest:
Quote:
“Sometimes you’re playing Fantasy Football and sometimes you’re in the real game,” Barton said. “We knew [Obama], if we could get a repeal bill to his desk, would almost certainly veto it. This time we knew if it got to the president’s desk it would be signed.”
In other words, it was easy talking about repeal and replace because Obama was president and we knew it would go nowhere. But now that we have the power and knew passage on the floor would be an obvious and assured co-sign by President Trump, any negative results of what would happen with its passage would all be on our heads and our party. AKA We'd own it.

That said, I wished it would have passed. People wanted him, repealing Obamacare was big on the agenda, so what gives? And it ticks me off that there were so many Trump supporters now suddenly against what he said he'd do. It should have passed, damn the consequences.

FULL ARTICLE
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