Current Politics in the United Kingdom

[judy84]

OK
Jack and the Beanstalk.


http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2018/12...mas-fairytale/

[palo5]

Yikes! Britain is being Sovietized. You are not allowed to know how good or bad things are

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...d-to-sign-ndas

Drug firms preparing for no-deal Brexit told to sign 'gagging orders'

[haroldeye]

The only reason to keep that information secret is to prevent a mass panic when people realise that there are going to be massive shortages.

Sounds like Sovietisation.

[judy84]

Originally Posted by BullDozer99

The only reason to keep that information secret is to prevent a mass panic when people realise that there are going to be massive shortages.

I wouldn't say it is the only possible reason. It might be that May and her idiots are finally getting the idea of negotiation with the EU. Why tell the opposition how well or badly your preparations are going?


If preparations are all in hand, the EU might get worried and want to give more concessions on a Withdrawal Agreement. If they are going poorly the EU might try to shaft us even more.


The EU seems to be following any discussions we are having very closely.




"The whole point of the Brussels negotiating team is to ensure that the British pay for their impertinence by suffering and suffering badly.
A perfectly workable, fair and peaceful relationship between post-EU Britain and the EU remaining bloc could be signed tomorrow.
But for Brussels, a UK that was independent, content and flourishing would be a disaster.
There would be four or five copycats within a year of Britain surging back to trading prosperity. End of Utopia. End of bureaucratic dream-state. End of gravy train.
The idea that those running the EU are our "partners" is another porky-pie. They are our dedicated opponents who wish us nothing but misery.
It would be so nice if the May Government woke up and smelled the coffee."


https://www.express.co.uk/comment/co...ls-theresa-may

[palo5]

Originally Posted by judy84

"The whole point of the Brussels negotiating team is to ensure that the British pay for their impertinence by suffering and suffering badly.
A perfectly workable, fair and peaceful relationship between post-EU Britain and the EU remaining bloc could be signed tomorrow

This is complete nonsense, you know. First, you're dealing with representatives of 27 democratic governments, and they don't want to "punish" you. But they've always been clear that Britain can't be seen to benefit from leaving the EU, meaning: if you leave the club, you don't get to use the facilities

Second, the deal you have is the best you'll get because of your "red lines." This was pointed out to you more than 2 years ago by Michel Barnier in his chart:



You were told "it will be the easiest negotiation in history", "they need us more than we need them" and other such BS. Just enough of you believed it, but it wasn't true. If you voted leave on those grounds, you were conned big-time

There are other arguments, such as "sovereignty," "take back control" and "the EU is undemocratic." But they are weird, because they'll always have to obey treaties they sign -- including the magic trade deals they don't yet have -- and the EU is much more democratic than the UK anyway: EU countries use PR and all votes count, but in the UK half the votes don't count and they are ruled by a permanent minority

[judy84]

What I wrote was about the NDAs and the idea that it was "to keep that information secret is to prevent a mass panic when people realize that there are going to be massive shortages".


I'm sorry I should not have added the newspaper article which is someone else's thoughts.



No point in going through all the arguments again, we are where we are.

[jacques22]

A reminder in the Guardian of how Europe contributed to the wealth of the United Kingdom, which was considered the 'sick man' of Europe before joining:
https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...ild-reputation

I remember the 1970s as a young boy. Britain was a laughing stock, the “sick man of Europe”. The UK’s desperately poor productivity, terrible labour relations and propensity to strike earned the tag “the British disease”. Our growth rates consistently lagged behind those of the first members of the European Economic Community. Indeed, their economic success, and our weakness, was a driving force behind us joining the trade bloc.

[otokonomidori]

Originally Posted by jacques22

https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...ild-reputation
[/I]

The Guardian ! Hardly an unbiased source!

[jacques22]

Originally Posted by otokonomidori

The Guardian ! Hardly an unbiased source!

Shoot the messenger! A classic.
Do you dispute the fact that the UK was the 'sick man' of Europe in the 1970's?
Do you dispute the fact that productivity in the UK was low and the economy weaker than in other European nations?

I understand why it hurts the Brexiters: because it contradicts their false narrative that the EU is holding the UK back, preventing Britain from becoming great again. While in fact the UK should be grateful to the EEC/EU for helping the Brits have a more competitive economy through the Single Market.

But it's so hard for the Brexiters to say 'thank you' when for decades politicians like Farage, Johnson and Rees-Mogg have bad-mouthed the EU to stir their jingoistic agenda.

One simple example: the Customs Union.
Brexiters want to leave the CU because they want to sign their own free trade treaties and believe that they will get more than the EU without lowering British standards. Unicorns!
It's a no brainer for the UK to stay in the CU for the simple reason that the EU has better negotiators than the UK. The UK can thank the EU for the free trade treaties signed with Canada, Japan, South Korea and other countries.
You want evidence that the EU has better negotiators than the UK? May's deal! Unless Brexiters think May got the better of the EU in those negotiations.
And good luck dealing with the US and China on your own, because they will feel the UK's desperation and will bully British negotiators.

[SanteeFats]

Originally Posted by otokonomidori

The Guardian ! Hardly an unbiased source!

Oh c'mon man there are NO news sources that are pure truth and facts,IMO. Every one has a bias of some kind.
Most people just find those sources that agree with their preconceptions.
Why listen to something you don't want to hear!!