Windows 10?

[buttsie]

Originally Posted by Stroking_it

Isn't this being a tad dramatic?

Personally, auto updating was never switched on in the first place, then I just did a quick registry tweak to kill the GWX nag when it finally appeared (it never came back), made sure I read the notes for any updates I did apply and then eventually switched off updating completely for the last few months of the free offer.

TBH I'm still taking stories of people's machines being updated without them doing anything with a pinch of salt.

As most companies know all too many end users never read the fine print
Some try to exploit it


That would be why MS put out a message anyone experiencing issues please ring and we'll walk you through the minefield after the the picture became clear they'd scored an own goal
with the perceived forced upgrade.



This wasnt a one off


A California woman has won $10,000 from Microsoft after a sneaky Windows 10 update wrecked the computer she used to run her business.

http://vintage-erotica-forum.com/sho...postcount=1054


As the upgrade is effectively over its all a bit irrelevant

Will be interesting to see what percentage of W7/8 users opt for another OS and
leave MS over the next 3-6 years

[Ernesto75]

Originally Posted by buttsie

As the upgrade is effectively over its all a bit irrelevant

Will be interesting to see what percentage of W7/8 users opt for another OS and
leave MS over the next 3-6 years

Yes, that will be interesting.

But don't forget every machine is growing older (like us alas) and the next machines will not be under Win 7/8.1.

Most of them will be under Windows 10.

That's worrying, especially with Satya Nadella as Microsoft's CEO .

[buttsie]

All windows hardware needs replacing eventually but what you replace it with is the question

A lot of stories about Macs still working decades later

Maybe the closed system is the smart option

or

A W7/8 PC could be converted into a Linux / W 7/8/10 dual boot

If you have an IT tech remove the MS bloatware you'll probably think you've upgraded the hardware

I suspect a good few who are IT savvy will opt for the dual boot model given linux is free
and far more secure than windows could ever pretend to be given security updates are usually same day not 10 days on average for MS.

http://www.tomshardware.com/answers/...inux-mint.html

others will follow estreeters example and buy a mac

AUS775 dollars in Australia gets you the mac mini tower
over priced perhaps but if it lasts 10-20 years probably not

goodbye windows updates and most of the security concerns

As one user put it awhile back i'd use a Mac but everyone else uses windows docs on a PC


A mix of all main OS is the wise choice if you can afford it

[Ernesto75]

Originally Posted by buttsie

All windows hardware needs replacing eventually but what you replace it with is the question

A lot of stories about Macs still working decades later

Maybe the closed system is the smart option

or

A W7/8 PC could be converted into a Linux / W 7/8/10 dual boot

If you have an IT tech remove the MS bloatware you'll probably think you've upgraded the hardware

I suspect a good few who are IT savvy will opt for the dual boot model given linux is free
and far more secure than windows could ever pretend to be given security updates are usually same day not 10 days on average for MS.

http://www.tomshardware.com/answers/...inux-mint.html

others will follow estreeters example and buy a mac

AUS775 dollars in Australia gets you the mac mini tower
over priced perhaps but if it lasts 10-20 years probably not

goodbye windows updates and most of the security concerns

As one user put it awhile back i'd use a Mac but everyone else uses windows docs on a PC


A mix of all main OS is the wise choice if you can afford it

Buttsie, your post is full of wisdom, but there will still be the enterprises.

Personnally I do not know a company which uses only Linux.
Only Apple yes there are, but only Linux I think not.

[rlg118]

http://windowssecrets.com/newsletter...abe044662b826a

[Ernesto75]

Originally Posted by rlg118

http://windowssecrets.com/newsletter...abe044662b826a

Tracey Capen well sums up the real problems all windows 10 users are sure to encounter, sooner or later.

It was the same with Vista but there Microsoft programmers really surpass themselves.

Those idiots never cease to amaze me.

As to the delay in the upgrade that might be that someone more intelligent than the others found too much errors to release it.

I will give you only one exemple:
To-day I found out all my parameters were gone; I had to reset them.
Talk about a pleasure.

[Rick Danger]

Ohhhh, you're gonna love this.............

I saw a blurb about Microsoft moving to "rollup" style updates for Windows 7 or 8.1 in the same manner as Windows 10. My first thought was "How will we be able to control what's applied?". Woody Leonhard confirmed my suspicions: You won't be able to.

In short, starting in October whatever Microsoft wants you to have you'll get. Bad drivers? You get them. Updates for languages you never heard of? Ditto. Ads, Windows 10 pre-installs, other crapware you don't want? Too bad, it's yours.

So you either take it all, or stop updating your systems period. And since security updates will be rolled up with non-essentials, if you don't update your machine will quickly become a target for every vulnerability known to man.

Redmond of course is making the argument that this makes updating Windows 7 and 8.1 machines more uniform, therefore better. That this will help Windows users. I'd like to ask exactly which users told them this? Is this meant to "help" us maintain our systems, or merely a means for Microsoft to destabilize the Windows 7/8.1 install base to force users to abandon older versions and embrace Windows 10?

UNBELIEVABLE!


Woody on Windows

Microsoft changes Win7/8.1 updates, pushes even harder for Windows 10
Starting in October, patches will be cumulative and Win7/8.1 customers will effectively cede control of their PCs to Microsoft

By Woody Leonhard
InfoWorld | Aug 16, 2016

Windows 7 and 8.1 have had a good run, but that's about to come to a close. According to new guidelines, Microsoft will start rolling out Windows 7 and 8.1 (as well as Server 2008 R2, 2012, and 2012 R2) patches in undifferentiated monthly blobs. The patches will be cumulative, which eliminates the need to exercise judgment in selecting the patches you want. At the same time, though, the new approach severely hampers your ability to recover from bad patches -- and it allows Microsoft to put anything it wants on your Win7/8.1 PC.

If you haven't yet read Nathan Mercer's Aug. 15 post on further simplifying servicing models for Windows 7 and Windows 8.1, I suggest you do so now. https://blogs.technet.microsoft.com/...d-windows-8-1/

To a first approximation, Windows 7 and 8.1 customers have two choices: Stop updating entirely or accept everything Microsoft ships. There are some nuances: Admins for Win 7 and 8.1 PCs attached to an update server will be able to independently juggle the security and nonsecurity blobs, while Home users get both security and nonsecurity patches together. Monthly Flash updates and .Net cumulative updates will roll out independently. (See Paul Krill's InfoWorld article on .Net updating. http://www.infoworld.com/article/310...h-tuesday.html)

It's going to take Microsoft a while to fold all of its old patches into the new scheme, but by and large, starting in October it's Microsoft's way or the highway.

As you might expect, many longtime Windows 7 devotees (present company included) are livid. After years of picking and choosing patches based on their KB numbers, Microsoft is taking full control of the billion-or-so Windows machines that aren't yet absorbed into the Win10 fold. If one of the new patches breaks something, your only choice is binary: Remove all of the patches and wait a month for Microsoft to fix the bad one, or suck it up and live with the problem.

Those who are skeptical about Microsoft's new approach to snooping -- patch KB 2952664 is frequently mentioned in that regard, but other patches seem suspect -- have reason to don their tinfoil hats. The simple fact is we have no idea what information Microsoft is collecting from Windows 7 and 8.1 systems, and we have no way to find out. What's certain: If you want to keep your PC patched, you won't have much choice.

Those who lived through the Get Windows 10 debacle now have even more reason for concern. Instead of pushing back against specific patches, such as the reviled KB 3035583, Win 7 and 8.1 customers will be able to choose between Microsoft's regimen or nothing at all.

Even those who are willing to open their machines to Microsoft have good reason to fear bad patches. We've had lots of them over the years. Less than a year ago, for example, Microsoft released, then re-released, then re-re-released Windows 7 security patch KB 3097877, which froze Outlook, blocked Network logons, and killed several programs. Patching Windows 7 and 8.1 is an iffy proposition.

We don't have many details about the new approach, but presumably Win 7 and 8.1 will be modified to include the ability to roll back the last patch, much as Windows 10 lets you roll back a cumulative patch. There's no talk of allowing users to preemptively block new patches; there certainly won't be any granularity in the new patching scheme: You either take it or you don't -- and if you stop taking one patch, you stop taking them all.

As long as Microsoft doesn't screw up the patches -- and customers are willing to put up with Microsoft's snooping -- this new approach certainly has benefits. Presumably the hours-long waits for Windows Update scans will go away. The new Update routine ("servicing stack") only needs to download the deltas -- the changes from the previous version. Everybody will be running the same version of Windows, which should make it easier to keep the patches working.

I say "should" because Microsoft's record ain't so hot. Cumulative updating in Windows 10 has worked well, although there was a problem earlier this month, with a printer bug introduced by the latest cumulative update, that is not yet fixed. Pundits will note that the Win10 installed base is considerably cleaner than the Win7 and Win8.1 jungle. The move to the Anniversary Update, which has been rife with problems, is a different story.

Cumulative updating in Office -- that is, Office Click-to-Run -- hasn't been so problem-free. There were significant bugs in December that wiped out Word macros and customizations; two in February that caused documents to freeze on open and knocked out POP3/deleted mail; one in April that crashed Lync/Skype for Business and Outlook; one in June that caused Office apps to throw an error 30145-4; and another in July where Excel won't open renamed HTML files. That doesn't bode well for Windows 7 as a service.

Microsoft's been consolidating patches of late -- KB 3161647 can only be installed if you're willing to accept six unrelated patches, for example. At least one InterNet Explorer "security" patch has included nonsecurity fixes as well. You have to wonder if this new approach will further blur the line.

Microsoft once again promises to fix its ancient Update Catalog site, which still requires ActiveX and thus Internet Explorer. That's a familiar refrain.

There are many unanswered questions. For example, the official announcement says, "The Security-only update will be available to download and deploy from WSUS, SCCM, and the Microsoft Update Catalog." That would seem to imply that sufficiently motivated Windows 7 users who aren't attached to an update server will be able to help themselves to only security patches and shun the nonsecurity patches.

It appears there will no longer be identifying information for individual patches. Instead, we'll see "consolidated release notes with the Rollups for all supported versions of Windows." It remains to be seen if that's the death knell for monthly security bulletins. It certainly means we'll see a huge reduction in the number of KB-identified patches.

We also don't know what will happen to the distinction between Recommended and Optional patches. Perhaps we'll all get patches for the Azerbaijani Manit or we'll all get tanked by a change to the Russian ruble.

Be of good cheer. If the old Windows Update check boxes don't work right, Microsoft can push out an update that removes them or changes what they do. Maybe an unchecked box will become equivalent to the old checked box, or vice-versa. In either case, you won't have much choice in the matter.

In this brave new world, one has to wonder if it's worth the effort to fight Windows 10. Microsoft is removing two of the great distinguishing features of Win7/8.1 -- granularity of updates and the ability to control them -- while opening Win7 and 8.1 to the same snooping features that are in Win10. Is resistance futile?

The discussion continues on AskWoody.com. https://www.askwoody.com/2016/win7-a...ative-updates/

[Rick Danger]

Microsoft put out an "Important" update today, KB3177723. Why? Because the nation of Egypt has permanently canceled its observation of Daylight Savings Time (DST).

Duh-uhhh, WHAT???

I grant you, this is not a huge patch. But is it necessary? This is just another example, like the infamous Azerbaijani currency update, of a "junk" update from Microsoft. FYI, that simple update broke functionality in the popular Crystal Reports application. Not so simple that it couldn't cause problems.

As i stated several posts ago, adopting a sloppy approach to managing changes on computer systems will get you into trouble. And as Woody Leonhard stated, if you just blindly accept what Microsoft is sending down as updates trouble will come more sooner than later. And there is more than enough objective evidence to support this as fact, not mere opinion or "Microsoft bashing".

I elected not to install KB3177723, after reviewing the available documentation. But come October, you lose this discretionary ability to manage your system(s) as you see fit.

From the initial reactions of IT professionals that I have seen, they are not happy that Microsoft has put this additional burden on them. As usual, large enterprise shops with good tools and a choice of update methodologies will work around this. For smaller shops, and of course home users, once again Microsoft has shown a total disdain for what we may think.

I'm sure some bright individuals in the Windows ecosystem may be able to devise a way around this latest attempt to "help" Windows users. But it is clear that Microsoft has become a "fly by night" company, totally uninterested in the opinions or welfare of it's user community.

A real pity.

[buttsie]

Originally Posted by Ernesto75

Buttsie, your post is full of wisdom, but there will still be the enterprises.

Personnally I do not know a company which uses only Linux.
Only Apple yes there are, but only Linux I think not.

I'm only thinking about personal use

Government & business are only interested in the cheapest option 99 times out of a 100

The bean counters in government still use IE browsers
speaks volumes for what occurs at the enterprise level


Interesting to see this update fun isnt just at the W10 level

I've seen no less than 2 KB suggestions that W7 / 8.1 users need to download to stop the snail paced updates from entering the ridiculous marathon stage

makes one wonder where these KBs disappeared to if they were so valuable

Step by step suggestions
http://www.digitaltrends.com/computi...-isnt-working/




AMD’s new driver fixes a bug that caused Anniversary Update installation issues
By Kevin Parrish — August 15, 2016 3:44 PM


http://www.digitaltrends.com/computi...n-no-mans-sky/

[Ernesto75]

Originally Posted by buttsie

I'm only thinking about personal use

Government & business are only interested in the cheapest option 99 times out of a 100

The bean counters in government still use IE browsers
speaks volumes for what occurs at the enterprise level

I was speaking about businesses.

That depends on the degree of quality of their security management.

Obviously if one rely solely on what is said by Microsoft teams...