Current Politics in the United Kingdom - Page 684

**frankoboff** · June 9th, 2019, 10:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by haroldeye

Franko - Britain was not the same from 1948 to 2008. And Blair admitted that for a short time he was a marxist.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...ook-on-trotsky

There was a consensus in British politics from 1945-2008. A small group in Thatchers government didn’t like it but they didn’t completely destroy it.

Sorry if it wasn’t blindly obvious but I was taking about attitudes towards Blair as an adult in government not Blair as a teenager reading about politics. You must be fantastically right wing if you think their was anything radical left about New Labour unless of course you define you politics on what you hate rather than what you believe in. I suspect this might be the case for a lot of Conservative voters.

**seany65** · June 9th, 2019, 10:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vinceprince

The fact that turnout was only 48.4% and of them only 28.9% voted for the Brexit Party. So only about 14% of the electorate could be bothered to vote for the Brexit Party even though they knew the huge significance of this by-election in terms of national political momentum and that the whole country was watching.

I think that perfectly shows their objective is not as important or popular as many seem to want to admit.

One could say that 51.6% were so unbothered about remaining that they didn't vote for any of the remainer parties. So perhaps remaining isn't as important or popular as many seem to want to admit.

**scoundrel** · June 9th, 2019, 10:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by frankoboff

unless of course you define you politics on what you hate rather than what you believe in. I suspect this might be the case for a lot of Conservative voters.

The only reason why I have ever voted Tory or would do so again is thatv the rest are devoted to thwarting the 2016 referendum vote and only the Tories are even trying to deliver on it. I don't hate the parties - but there is not one political party in Britain which represents me. The Lib-Dems could have, but have shown themselves ridiculously uncritical of anything EU related, even since the Euro if not before. It's a pity, because I have always been attracted to their moderate and humane philosophy; but they aren't pragmatic anymore. Labour I will never ever forgive for being unwilling to fight when Britain was attacked in 1982 - just not acceptable. The Tories briefly tempted me during the immediate aftermath of the Brexit referendum but when I read Mrs Mays manifesto I remembered all the reasons why I have always distanced myself from them all my life. I mean...bring back foxhunting? WTF?

Once we are safely out of the EU, the unrelenting urge felt by the Change Party to suck Jean Claude Juncker's male member will cease to be important. I follow their halting progress with some interest, feeling that the defection of Chuka Umunna and some others may be an improvement in their prospects. But right now, no one speaks for me in this parliament

**frankoboff** · June 9th, 2019, 11:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scoundrel

The only reason why I have ever voted Tory or would do so again is thatv the rest are devoted to thwarting the 2016 referendum vote and only the Tories are even trying to deliver on it. I don't hate the parties - but there is not one political party in Britain which represents me. The Lib-Dems could have, but have shown themselves ridiculously uncritical of anything EU related, even since the Euro if not before. It's a pity, because I have always been attracted to their moderate and humane philosophy; but they aren't pragmatic anymore. Labour I will never ever forgive for being unwilling to fight when Britain was attacked in 1982 - just not acceptable. The Tories briefly tempted me during the immediate aftermath of the Brexit referendum but when I read Mrs Mays manifesto I remembered all the reasons why I have always distanced myself from them all my life. I mean...bring back foxhunting? WTF?

Once we are safely out of the EU, the unrelenting urge felt by the Change Party to suck Jean Claude Juncker's male member will cease to be important. I follow their halting progress with some interest, feeling that the defection of Chuka Umunna and some others may be an improvement in their prospects. But right now, no one speaks for me in this parliament

I find it a little worrying that people vote for political parties based on their competence at overly nationalistic political messaging. Seems like you can drape a flag over any policy and it'll be popular with a section of the electorate, no matter how harmful or counter-intuitive.

We will never be 'safely out of the EU'. They will always have a proxy on UK laws as they're the biggest political and economic block in the World. The United States which is the 2nd biggest political block will also have a say too. We will not have a say on policy inside either of those political blocks. I don't think you voted Leave to become a client state of either the EU or the USA.

**otokonomidori** · June 10th, 2019, 01:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by frankoboff

I suspect this might be the case for a lot of Conservative voters.

Funny, I've always thought the same thing about the Left.

**frankoboff** · June 10th, 2019, 03:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by otokonomidori

Funny, I've always thought the same thing about the Left.

Coming from the man that refers to his fellow Scots as "haggis wavers".

**Devius** · June 10th, 2019, 06:11 AM

The UK and South Korea have signed an in principle free trade agreement (FTA) that seeks to maintain existing trade arrangements post-Brexit.

International Trade Secretary Liam Fox signed the deal with his South Korean counterpart Yoo Myung-hee in Seoul.

The preliminary agreement marks the first post-Brexit trade deal the UK has secured in Asia.

The agreement is roughly in line with the terms of the existing Korea-EU FTA.

It would cover South Korean exports including cars and auto parts. South Korea exports mostly cars and ships to Britain, while it imports crude oil and cars.

The agreement is designed to provide stability under a no-deal Brexit, with the UK due to leave the EU on 31 October, with or without a deal.

"The deal is significant as it eased uncertainties sparked by Brexit, amid the already challenging environment for exports on the escalating trade row between Washington and Beijing," Ms Yoo said.

Both countries aim to ratify the deal by the end of October, and implement it in November.

South Korea - Asia's fourth largest economy - is a global leader in electronics, steel and auto industry.

The country's exports to the UK hit $6.36bn (£5.0bn) last year.

The UK is South Korea's second largest trading partner among EU members, and the Asian nation's 18th largest trading partner.

Source:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-48577667

**vinceprince** · June 10th, 2019, 07:35 AM

Boris is proposing a an effective tax cut but only for about 3 million higher rate tax payers even though in the current hung Parliament there is pretty much zero chance of getting such a bill through and it's not really a measure to sway the marginals in an election. Strange proposal then really isn't it? And he's never talked about this before.

Oh wait, many Tory Party members are higher rate earners and will ultimately decide who is Tory Leader.

Probably just a coincidence

.

**frankoboff** · June 10th, 2019, 11:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vinceprince

Boris is proposing a an effective tax cut but only for about 3 million higher rate tax payers even though in the current hung Parliament there is pretty much zero chance of getting such a bill through and it's not really a measure to sway the marginals in an election. Strange proposal then really isn't it? And he's never talked about this before.

Oh wait, many Tory Party members are higher rate earners and will ultimately decide who is Tory Leader.

Probably just a coincidence

.

and the Boris machine is in full swing along with the Johnson-Gove pact. Tells socially conservative newspaper that he took cocaine on a regular basis, thus intentionally loosing the race and gets made chancellor to Boris's PM. Osborne proved coke 'n hookers + chancellorship is ok.

(Nothing against coke 'n hookers btw).

**haroldeye** · June 10th, 2019, 04:34 PM

Frank the post war consensus lasted until the middle 1970's when it was destroyed by a large dollop of reality. British management was incompetent verging on disastrous, half the Unions were led by marxist gobshites and the country was fast running out of money. Thatcher took the credit for breaking union power but she didn't, it was a very quiet revolution in the attitude of people to both unions and government. Neither Major nor Blair could be compared to the pre 1980's politicians. It was a different world and they were men of their time.
Now you said 'These are the kind of people that think Tony Blair was a Marxist.' and I pointed out that for a time he was. No it wasn't blindly obvious what you meant, just another statement that you throw around.
I can't speak for Conservative voters, I've always been a floating voter myself, having voted Labour, Conservative and 'Non of the Above' since my first election in 1975. I seem to remember the SWP, WRP types from my student days were the ones pedalling the hatred. I couldn't possibly attribute such negative views to any of their supporters nowadays though

June 10th, 2019, 06:11 AM	#6837
Devius Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: It's a London Thing.... Posts: 23,468 Thanks: 141,991 Thanked 228,168 Times in 23,504 Posts	UK signs post-Brexit free trade deal with South Korea The UK and South Korea have signed an in principle free trade agreement (FTA) that seeks to maintain existing trade arrangements post-Brexit. International Trade Secretary Liam Fox signed the deal with his South Korean counterpart Yoo Myung-hee in Seoul. The preliminary agreement marks the first post-Brexit trade deal the UK has secured in Asia. The agreement is roughly in line with the terms of the existing Korea-EU FTA. It would cover South Korean exports including cars and auto parts. South Korea exports mostly cars and ships to Britain, while it imports crude oil and cars. The agreement is designed to provide stability under a no-deal Brexit, with the UK due to leave the EU on 31 October, with or without a deal. "The deal is significant as it eased uncertainties sparked by Brexit, amid the already challenging environment for exports on the escalating trade row between Washington and Beijing," Ms Yoo said. Both countries aim to ratify the deal by the end of October, and implement it in November. South Korea - Asia's fourth largest economy - is a global leader in electronics, steel and auto industry. The country's exports to the UK hit $6.36bn (£5.0bn) last year. The UK is South Korea's second largest trading partner among EU members, and the Asian nation's 18th largest trading partner. Source: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-48577667 __________________ "I've had it with them, I've had it with you, I've had it with ALL THIS - I WANT ROOM SERVICE!* I want the club sandwich, I want the cold Mexican beer, I want a $10,000-a-night hooker!"* Johnny Mnemonic (1995)

June 10th, 2019, 07:35 AM	#6838
vinceprince 13th Duke of Wybourne Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Me, Here? In a sixth-form girl's dormitory? At 3 in the morning? With my reputation? Posts: 2,089 Thanks: 8,082 Thanked 21,964 Times in 2,076 Posts	Boris is proposing a an effective tax cut but only for about 3 million higher rate tax payers even though in the current hung Parliament there is pretty much zero chance of getting such a bill through and it's not really a measure to sway the marginals in an election. Strange proposal then really isn't it? And he's never talked about this before. Oh wait, many Tory Party members are higher rate earners and will ultimately decide who is Tory Leader. Probably just a coincidence.

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June 10th, 2019, 04:34 PM	#6840
haroldeye Moderator Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Halfwitistan Posts: 5,715 Thanks: 113,487 Thanked 59,962 Times in 5,707 Posts	Frank the post war consensus lasted until the middle 1970's when it was destroyed by a large dollop of reality. British management was incompetent verging on disastrous, half the Unions were led by marxist gobshites and the country was fast running out of money. Thatcher took the credit for breaking union power but she didn't, it was a very quiet revolution in the attitude of people to both unions and government. Neither Major nor Blair could be compared to the pre 1980's politicians. It was a different world and they were men of their time. Now you said 'These are the kind of people that think Tony Blair was a Marxist.' and I pointed out that for a time he was. No it wasn't blindly obvious what you meant, just another statement that you throw around. I can't speak for Conservative voters, I've always been a floating voter myself, having voted Labour, Conservative and 'Non of the Above' since my first election in 1975. I seem to remember the SWP, WRP types from my student days were the ones pedalling the hatred. I couldn't possibly attribute such negative views to any of their supporters nowadays though