Am I just naive?

[mrkenl]

I have been looking at Pl*yboy, P*nthouse, G*nesis, G*llery, etc. for years but I never really got into porn films. A few years ago I started to see some online adults videos and got to know some of the talent. Then when I would see a modern H*stler or P*nthouse on this site I saw that pretty much ALL of the models were porn stars. Was it always this way? Were models of all of these magazines always pros or was there the occasional "girl who needed the money"? Many models I recognize from having so many pictorials but there are a lot that I only see one time. What light can you experts shed on that subject? Thanks.

[Meini Again]

mrkenl.... you've been a member of this forum for 9 years

How can you be naive?

Meself, I never go by choice to HC stuff, but I do read the fascinating knowledge many ... many members post about people/films.

Some Ladies retire early, some develop Websites... some as Louis Theroux explained, remain as Escorts/Dancers etc, and sell VHS/CD/DVD/BluRay private copies of their un-marketed performances ~ to their clients/customers.

It's business. Some give up, some power on.
From magazines to film, was easier in the US and Europe.
Almost impossible in the UK, unless Softcore.

The vast majority of the Ladies / Girls ... by 21-25 yrs old .....left the scene, or powered on...

~ imo



Stay Safe

[mrkenl]

I guess I'm saying... if I looked at a Pl*yboy or P*nthouse in the 1980s or 1990s, were ALL of those models pros? I assume that most of the Pl*yboy models were not although I know many went on to do more... Lin Thomas, Pam Anderson and some others. But when I see a modern P*nthouse it seems like every one of them is already an established porn star and I did not realize that's what I was seeing 30+ years ago.

[Meini Again]

I apologise mrkenl...

You are naive....

I'm a HC wimp and avoider of HC .... but I read this forum for the knowledge that poster's bring.
There's an insight and knowledge that the "Rialto Report" would die for

In 9 Years, how you have not picked up on the wisdom of past-and-present contributors.... actually befuddles me.

I don't see the point of your Thread, beyond "Self-Direction"

~ which I have done.... buggar

Take Care Fella

Stay Safe Everyone

[Pinkpapercut]

I don't think you are/were naive. I'm coming to this from a British angle, you, going from the magazines you used to prefer, are almost certainly somewhere in North America. I'm also probably one of the older members here at coming up to 62, and I began buying porn days after my 15th birthday so I have nearly 50 years of porn use behind me.

For roughly the first 10 years, between the early 1970s and early 1980s my porn habit was almost entirely about buying UK girly magazines. Mild hardcore - oral, vaginal, dildo penetrations - in some UK girly magazines was very briefly available in the UK in the the mid 1970s but in actuality it was only freely available here from the early 90s. Before the 90s you could find European hardcore on sale in back street shops here, hardcore videos also often available under the counter in mainstream video rental shops. But hardcore was illegal, usually expensive and even in a big city relatively hard to find.

I enjoyed and enjoy hardcore but until around 1992 I bought it only sporadically and rarely. I hugely prioritised girly magazines instead. They were easy to get, they were cheaper than hardcore mags and videos, and they did the job well enough for me when I was between relationships and wanking a lot.

So I had little exposure to whatever hardcore careers British girly magazine models might have running in parallel to their photo sets I was wanking over. I knew some UK girls had careers in Euro hardcore because every now and then on my porn buying expeditions I would see a UK girly model on a Euro HC mag or video cover getting variously fucked.

It was only after 1992 that I had regular access to hardcore mags and videos and particularly to back issues of mags from the PR*VATE stable, C*C*C and milder hardcore like 'Pleasure' magazine and realised quite how many British girlie models who appeared 'butter-wouldn't-melt' had been and still were doing vaginal, oral, and anal to say the very least in European HC mags and videos. I also show came to realise that many of these girls had further parallel careers as strippers.

It was only when I became a member of online forums like VEF that I realised many of my favourite models not only did hardcore and stripping but were also high-class prostitutes and that instead of of just wanking over them in porn I could have been actually fucking them.

Having made a career out of explicit depictions of their sexuality it came as no surprise that many girly magazine models were/are happy to have sex for money but to assume of any single model that she was into harder sexwork, either in porn or in bedrooms, would have been too much of a reach.

I had been aware that many of the American girly models I'd liked in the late 70s had parallel usually far more extensive careers as hardcore porn stars but I didn't see see most of their 70s HC movies until this last 10 years. For instance back in the 70s I loved the straightforward girly sets I had of Desiree Cousteau but I didn't see any of her hardcore movies until a friend here at VEF directed me to them.

If you weren't into hardcore films, even given the huge USA hardcore movie industry, or mags like Hustler that made a big deal of its models' pornstar backgrounds, and you preferred the Pl*yboy, P*nthouse, Genesis end of the mag market I don't see why you would have assumed that very many of the models in those mags, if not pornstars at the time, became pornstars.

You were just reasonably taking things at face value, which we all do.

Originally Posted by mrkenl

I have been looking at Pl*yboy, P*nthouse, G*nesis, G*llery, etc. for years but I never really got into porn films. A few years ago I started to see some online adults videos and got to know some of the talent. Then when I would see a modern H*stler or P*nthouse on this site I saw that pretty much ALL of the models were porn stars. Was it always this way? Were models of all of these magazines always pros or was there the occasional "girl who needed the money"? Many models I recognize from having so many pictorials but there are a lot that I only see one time. What light can you experts shed on that subject? Thanks.

[banquomerc]

and to add to this thread, it would be equally fascinating to see the effects after of porn careers whether flash in the pan, Pl***b*y, prostitution, stripping, etc-big difference in careers of Christy Canyon and Bridgette Monet and Sylvia McFarland or Pam Anderson or Kay Parker, Nina Hartley-given my age, it is very interesting to see how they all and more dealt with youthful choices compared to turning 50, 60, or 70 plus.

[sea-man]

@ Pinkpapercut
I totally agree, how many models who were posing in UK mags were making h/c on the side?
Who paid for the European trips so many times seen in UK mags? Really, only the most gullible would believe that one trip would pay for the holiday in Spain. So many top shelfers are working for themselves. It only takes a short time on the internet to find them working as escorts. Thanks for your extensive post.

[Christyfan78]

Very few of Playboy , Penthouse , or Hustler models went on to have long lasting career's . Also would say most of them posing in the major magazine's , were not in hard core films .

[Pinkpapercut]

Originally Posted by sea-man

@ Pinkpapercut
I totally agree, how many models who were posing in UK mags were making h/c on the side?
Who paid for the European trips so many times seen in UK mags? Really, only the most gullible would believe that one trip would pay for the holiday in Spain. So many top shelfers are working for themselves. It only takes a short time on the internet to find them working as escorts. Thanks for your extensive post.

Funnily enough sea-man I hadn't considered the implication of all those UK girly sets obviously photographed in southern Spain or the Balearics. Which sort of reinforces my point that it's not necessarily naivety that allows the likes of mrkenl the original poster or indeed my younger self to fail to make the connection that many girly models had a parallel career in hardcore.

I was aware are of the odd one or two but it wasn't until I started regularly using hardcore in the early 90s and got access to lots of back issues very cheaply that I realised that well-known girly models and even girly models who had been UK Page 3 girls
had careers in hardcore.

But it hadn't clicked in my mind until you just mentioned it that many of the girls who were appearing in girly sets in Spanish poolside settings just spreading their legs we're on the same trip taking part in hardcore photo sets and videos filmed at the same Spanish villas as part of the same Spanish 'working holiday'. The evidence was there, I'm not naive but I wasn't joining the dots.

Given the cheapness of air travel from Britain to Spain and the cheapness of ferries to Copenhagen, Holland and North Germany etc it's no surprise that even very minor UK girly models would nip over under their own steam and get themselves filmed doing a bit of shagging that would then turn up up in one of the many PR*VATE or C*C*C series.

I think one particular series of late 80s sets brought home to me the calibre of UK girly model that was doing hardcore in parallel was discovering set after set after set of British former page 3 girl and Raymond magazines diary girl Andrea Clarke being gangbanged in a Spanish setting. Seeing a girl I was only familiar with doing nude work in girly mags, albeit sometimes happily showing her cunt and arsehole, but in photosets where she was simultaneously being shagged, bummed, sucking cock and receiving massive facials made it finally sink in how very far many of the UK girly models were prepared to go and WERE going.

It's quite easy to delude oneself and not make the connections that are obvious. An example related to porn, back in the 90s I went through a brief period of contacting 'glamour models' who advertised in the classifieds of UK magazines like 'Amateur Photographer'. I had just wanted to have the experience of taking my own softcore of models. I visited a few and discovered that the 'Glamour Shoot' would sometimes lead to sex for an extra payment. I went back perhaps 10 times to one girl in particular, based outside Oldham near Manchester. She had a professional studio but from the very first shoot she offered sex at the end for an extra payment.

I never thought of her as a prostitute, she was a genuine model who showed me her modelling book featuring both soft and hard core work she'd done. I thought I was just having sex with a glamour model for a little extra financial consideration. It's only in the last 5 years or so that I've accepted I was deceiving myself and what I was actually doing was shagging a prostitute who had started off in glamour modelling.

I preferred to maintain my delusion that I don't go with prostitutes so I disregarded the plain evidence in front of me.

We can miss the obvious or choose to miss the obvious for very many reasons, sometimes just through inattention.

[sea-man]

Well said, you can see the same villas being used in hc as well as soft. I have lots of information regarding the escort scene during the mid to late 1980's since I used to go to Spain every summer for a good old piss up with friends and recognised too many top shelfers 'working' out there.



from http://vintage-erotica-forum.com/sho...4273&page=2240
post http://vintage-erotica-forum.com/sho...ostcount=22393

http://www.imagebam.com/image/ab16801350582294
I think this is hayley russell. She used to escort in the Reading area some years ago.
Had a severe drug problem.




Relevant thread: http://vintage-erotica-forum.com/sho...11#post5302811


More soft but also hardcore: http://vintage-erotica-forum.com/sho...d.php?t=390591