49 people killed at 2 Christchurch NZ mosques. - Page 4

**scoundrel** · March 16th, 2019, 04:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by otokonomidori

I agree with Welderman

I agree with Nightjar.

Estreeter · March 16th, 2019, 08:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jenny48549

Seems to me that everyone totally missed the point here especially as far as the "manifesto" goes.

Thanks Jenny

Seems this thread got a little heated.

There's normal Christians, Muslims, Jews, whatever group.
There's nutcases in all those groups also.

Jacinda Adern put it best in her press briefing
"people with extremist views have no place in New Zealand, in fact have no place in the world"

That goes for any group be it religious, political, racial, it's nutcases that cause this crap, not the groups in general.

**Devius** · March 16th, 2019, 10:31 AM

An Australian senator who sparked outrage for blaming the New Zealand mosque shootings on Muslim immigration has been hit on the head with a raw egg.

Footage caught by TV cameras showed a 17-year-old boy cracking an egg on Fraser Anning's head before the independent senator appeared to punch the teenager in the face.

A brief scuffle ensued and the boy was arrested before being released without charge pending investigation.

In the wake of the outrage, which left 49 people dead at two mosques in Christchurch, Mr Anning tweeted: "Does anyone still dispute the link between Muslim immigration and violence?"

Source:
https://www.itv.com/news/2019-03-16/...tion-is-egged/

slaphead12 · March 16th, 2019, 01:06 PM

BAN ALL RELIGION, There is no God, so its all a bunch of BS anyway

**Old Jud** · March 16th, 2019, 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gordon3

As right-wing failures, like Trump & Brexit, begin to seriously fall apart across the globe, you're going to see an epidemic of white terrorism, and it is terrorism. One the one hand, increased terror incidents like these, with global implications, such as the Pittsburgh massacre, shouldn't be that surprising.

Really Gordon? Have you done your homework on Brexit?
How come so many on the FAR-LEFT support it, including the esteemed Comrade Corbyn?

Brexit has nothing to do with with far-right murderous nut jobs.
Sadly there will be an Islamic extremist reaction to this, not necessarily in New Zealand.
In the UK the Police have increased security around mosques, this needs to be balanced with increased security at public events, sports, music concerts and the like.

**Rogerbh** · March 16th, 2019, 01:49 PM

I am not religious and I do not understand religious fervor. However, it is easy to see that religious people are much more willing to sacrifice themselves for their cause. I mean look at the number of suicide bombers in the world.

Some of these whack jobs from either side are going to take it out on a religious congregation near them.

Don't they say - God helps them who help themselves - ? If you are religious and you go to public gathering places - you should have some sort of security armed or unarmed near your exits. It seems to me the minimal prudent thing to do.

I haven't seen that video of the New Zealand shooting, but they say one of the unarmed worshippers rushed the shooter and died knocking him down, if more than one had done the same, he could have been disarmed. People will die in the attempt, but not in the numbers they did when the nutter was allowed to keep attacking unmolested.

I agree that this event is extremely unlikely to happen near you, but people buy insurance for unlikely events - right? Placing your biggest, strongest people near exits seems reasonable to me.

**Nightjar** · March 16th, 2019, 03:11 PM

The following describes the event, so, read it with caution...

Unfortunately, the people at the front entrance to the larger mosque were shot from about 15 feet away with a pump action shotgun - not much chance for them to even register what was going on, let alone what was about to happen.

The attacker then proceeded up the main corridor into the main hall and switched to an assault rifle and began shooting clusters of people who'd fled to the both the left and right near-side corners of the hall, where (I think) there were single door exits leading to other parts of the building (not outdoors).

This caused an inevitable bottleneck of panicking people with their backs turned.

The whole horrific event unfolded within the building because of the interior layout, wherein no one could see what was coming until it was happening.

I can only imagine that the second attack occurred in a more open space wherein those who tackled the gunman - disarming him and causing him to flee - were able assess the situation and act in a more proactive and aggressive manner, thus saving potentially many more lives.

**Rogerbh** · March 16th, 2019, 04:42 PM

https://www.latimes.com/world/la-fg-...316-story.html
(I didn't actually read the article as I don't subscribe to it) This segment is regarding the second mosque attack:

Inside the Linwood Mosque, 30-year-old Faisal Sayed heard a banging sound. He and another worshiper broke prayer and rushed to look out a window.

Two congregants who had been running late to the service had been shot outside, he said. A gunman dressed in military-style clothing was headed inside, firing at worshipers.

One person was shot in the head, as was a woman who had given up her spot to another congregant just before services began. A third person was shot in the shoulder. A total of seven would be slain at the Linwood Mosque.

Amid the chaos, one of the congregants confronted the attacker and grabbed his weapon, Sayed said in an interview.

“He held the rifle,” Sayed said of the man who fought back, causing the gunman to drop the weapon and flee.

“If this guy was not there,” Sayed said, “I don’t think I would be talking to you right now.” He did not identify the man.

**Devius** · March 16th, 2019, 04:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Old Jud

Sadly there will be an Islamic extremist reaction to this, not necessarily in New Zealand.
In the UK the Police have increased security around mosques, this needs to be balanced with increased security at public events, sports, music concerts and the like.

On this we can be certain...and we also know that Islamic extremist reaction could in turn "inspire" a counter-reaction by another person (or persons) consumed with hatred against those who are considered "different" from his/her/their definition of normalcy. It appears 'For Rotherham' was written on ammunition used in the mosque massacre - an apparent reference to the Rotherham sex abuse scandal.

As if things were not bad enough, today's communications technology now not only allows the Islamic jihadists and the white supremacists a global audience; it allows them a connectivity with said audience that 20th century terrorists like the Dawson's Field hijackers could only dream about, when they blew up three passenger aircraft held in the Jordanian desert in front of the international press on 12 September 1970.

Where do we go from here? I wish I knew (I know of two friends of mine who were sent the massacre footage yesterday, and thought it was a new video game).

Right now it feels we are mired in a dance of death between the Islamofascists and the anti-Muslim extreme right-wingers....

**gedly** · March 16th, 2019, 06:53 PM

Violence exists in all societies. Every society creates angry, bitter and disillusioned young people.

March 16th, 2019, 10:31 AM	#33
Devius Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: It's a London Thing.... Posts: 23,504 Thanks: 142,105 Thanked 228,330 Times in 23,539 Posts	Egg cracked on head of Australian senator Fraser Anning who blamed New Zealand attack on Muslim immigration An Australian senator who sparked outrage for blaming the New Zealand mosque shootings on Muslim immigration has been hit on the head with a raw egg. Footage caught by TV cameras showed a 17-year-old boy cracking an egg on Fraser Anning's head before the independent senator appeared to punch the teenager in the face. A brief scuffle ensued and the boy was arrested before being released without charge pending investigation. In the wake of the outrage, which left 49 people dead at two mosques in Christchurch, Mr Anning tweeted: "Does anyone still dispute the link between Muslim immigration and violence?" Source: https://www.itv.com/news/2019-03-16/...tion-is-egged/ __________________ "I've had it with them, I've had it with you, I've had it with ALL THIS - I WANT ROOM SERVICE!* I want the club sandwich, I want the cold Mexican beer, I want a $10,000-a-night hooker!"* Johnny Mnemonic (1995)

March 16th, 2019, 01:06 PM	#34
slaphead12 Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 378 Thanks: 965 Thanked 3,188 Times in 356 Posts	BAN ALL RELIGION, There is no God, so its all a bunch of BS anyway

March 16th, 2019, 01:49 PM	#36
Rogerbh Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Land of the free within reasonable limitations Posts: 10,915 Thanks: 50,529 Thanked 91,237 Times in 10,763 Posts	I am not religious and I do not understand religious fervor. However, it is easy to see that religious people are much more willing to sacrifice themselves for their cause. I mean look at the number of suicide bombers in the world. Some of these whack jobs from either side are going to take it out on a religious congregation near them. Don't they say - God helps them who help themselves - ? If you are religious and you go to public gathering places - you should have some sort of security armed or unarmed near your exits. It seems to me the minimal prudent thing to do. I haven't seen that video of the New Zealand shooting, but they say one of the unarmed worshippers rushed the shooter and died knocking him down, if more than one had done the same, he could have been disarmed. People will die in the attempt, but not in the numbers they did when the nutter was allowed to keep attacking unmolested. I agree that this event is extremely unlikely to happen near you, but people buy insurance for unlikely events - right? Placing your biggest, strongest people near exits seems reasonable to me.

March 16th, 2019, 03:11 PM	#37
Nightjar Likes plump moths Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 4,830 Thanks: 18,826 Thanked 40,903 Times in 4,678 Posts	The following describes the event, so, read it with caution... Unfortunately, the people at the front entrance to the larger mosque were shot from about 15 feet away with a pump action shotgun - not much chance for them to even register what was going on, let alone what was about to happen. The attacker then proceeded up the main corridor into the main hall and switched to an assault rifle and began shooting clusters of people who'd fled to the both the left and right near-side corners of the hall, where (I think) there were single door exits leading to other parts of the building (not outdoors). This caused an inevitable bottleneck of panicking people with their backs turned. The whole horrific event unfolded within the building because of the interior layout, wherein no one could see what was coming until it was happening. I can only imagine that the second attack occurred in a more open space wherein those who tackled the gunman - disarming him and causing him to flee - were able assess the situation and act in a more proactive and aggressive manner, thus saving potentially many more lives.

March 16th, 2019, 04:42 PM	#38
Rogerbh Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Land of the free within reasonable limitations Posts: 10,915 Thanks: 50,529 Thanked 91,237 Times in 10,763 Posts	https://www.latimes.com/world/la-fg-...316-story.html (I didn't actually read the article as I don't subscribe to it) This segment is regarding the second mosque attack: Inside the Linwood Mosque, 30-year-old Faisal Sayed heard a banging sound. He and another worshiper broke prayer and rushed to look out a window. Two congregants who had been running late to the service had been shot outside, he said. A gunman dressed in military-style clothing was headed inside, firing at worshipers. One person was shot in the head, as was a woman who had given up her spot to another congregant just before services began. A third person was shot in the shoulder. A total of seven would be slain at the Linwood Mosque. Amid the chaos, one of the congregants confronted the attacker and grabbed his weapon, Sayed said in an interview. “He held the rifle,” Sayed said of the man who fought back, causing the gunman to drop the weapon and flee. “If this guy was not there,” Sayed said, “I don’t think I would be talking to you right now.” He did not identify the man.

March 16th, 2019, 06:53 PM	#40
gedly Veteran Member Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 3,234 Thanks: 19,883 Thanked 69,317 Times in 3,171 Posts	Violence exists in all societies. Every society creates angry, bitter and disillusioned young people.