The Football Thread - Page 834

**footstep** · March 17th, 2012, 08:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by snowy25

Just reading that Eric Abidal will now need a liver transplant a year after having a tumour removed from the same organ. Good luck to him and I hope to see him once again pulling on that Barca shirt. He staged a comeback before and I hope he manages it again.

The place taken by football nowadays in media has once more shown its great human qualities.In main medias everyone notice that he won't play euro 2012 for us.Sorry being french on that point.Lens lost 0 3 at Guingamp last night and in the end confirmation players have given up and happy of their 14th place.Won't pay again this year for a home match.and i am not alone.

**george anson** · March 17th, 2012, 09:14 AM

As we've discussed before until retrospective video punishment comes in coupled with severe penalties for cheats then the cheats will continue to prosper and this game will continue to be blighted by such appalling displays as from Drogba.

It needn't all be one way either as players wrongly punished could have their penalties reversed too albeit too late to affect the outcome of the game.

As for the Hillsborough news it's a very simple matter as history has shown time and time again for those who are actually culpable of the mistakes to pass the blame onto those who can longer speak and defend themselves.

If there were indeed drunken fans as is claimed why did the police officers even allow them near the ground in the first place ?

It is the FA Cup quarter final stage today and tomorrow. Unfortunately the Premier League seems to think as it is of course the best league in the world bar none that it should remain centre stage with a relatively full league programme.

Very disappointing Napoli managed to lose their match as I am no fan of Chelsea from the owner to certain players in that side like Terry and Cole and the enormous number of gloryhunters who have become Chelsea fans over recent seasons.

Benfica a club with infinitely richer history and traditions and acheivements are already being written off as cannon fodder. Nothing would give me greater pleasure to see the Eagles win.

Guardiola has described Bielsa as the best coach in the world today. Pep used to travel down to Buenos Aires to discuss tactics and footballing philosophies for hours so unsurprising there is admiration between master and pupil.

Barca's current tactics are those created by Bielsa a decade or more ago which unfortunately (requiring players at peak fitness) did not work in the 2002 WC for his Argentina who had between 2000-2002 swept aside everyone they had played.

One saw this in the game on Thursday night. If players like Munain, Martinez and Llorente can stay at Bilbao they could become a very good team over the next few seasons.

It is a remarkable transformation for a side that under Caparros played long ball in La Liga and a very physical game (a trait linked to their English heritage).

Both Bilbao and Barcelona have close links having suffered under the fascist regime of Franco and seen as representatives of the Basque nation and Catalonia.

**buttsie** · March 17th, 2012, 09:46 AM

All rather strange this feigning injury and diving given some of the best exponents of it are playing in several of the more successful teams going around at the moment.

Watching last seasons Real Madrid v Barcelona matches was like watching a bunch of actors training for a mock match in between the actual skilful playing of the ball.

As one commentator online said recently when there's SO much money at stake we shouldn't be surprised at the depths players will stoop to to gain the advantage.

**victor meldrew** · March 17th, 2012, 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by george anson

As we've discussed before until retrospective video punishment comes in coupled with severe penalties for cheats then the cheats will continue to prosper and this game will continue to be blighted by such appalling displays as from Drogba.

As for the Hillsborough news it's a very simple matter as history has shown time and time again for those who are actually culpable of the mistakes to pass the blame onto those who can longer speak and defend themselves.

It is the FA Cup quarter final stage today and tomorrow. Unfortunately the Premier League seems to think as it is of course the best league in the world bar none that it should remain centre stage with a relatively full league programme.

Benfica a club with infinitely richer history and traditions and acheivements are already being written off as cannon fodder. Nothing would give me greater pleasure to see the Eagles win.

The problem with retrospective punishment is who will decide what incidents are to be considered the Ref, the Authoroities or the media and if the other confederations do not take it on board, we are making a rod for our ownback.

Hillsborough was a disaster waiting to happen, once those fences went up and who really is to blame, The FA for allocating the Leppings Lane End to Liverpool? The Liverpool fans who did not have tickets, but went anyway. The police, for being poorly organised or the Government for having those fences with insufficient escape routes.
Hopefully once the report is finaly released the families concerned can get the closure they deserve.

As for the PL program, I seem to remember when I first started going to football, for the later rounds of the cup, a fairly full league program being in place.

Chelsea/Benfica, I believe it will be a close run thing, with either side being capable of progressing. The media and others here have always underestimated continental opposition Ajax v Liverpool and Deportivo v Aston Villa, being two prime examples

**IngramJohn** · March 17th, 2012, 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greenman

These are my thoughts on yesterday's revelations-I did ask if this was okay and one Mod said yes so I am taking a chance-I don't think it is too controversial.

Unfortunately, FACTS will not bring these people back mate period!

FAULT: Margaret Thatcher? The Police? Kelvin McKenzie? Was there no fault of any Liverpool supporter trying to get into a game they did not have a ticket to watch? (or were late due to roadworks)?

JUSTICE: If you have lost your child/husband/wife in ANY disaster how will justice help these people? Will they sleep better at night? Will they suddenly become happy and satisfied? I think not.

Maybe, as horrible as I may sound, we should 'move on', learn by our mistakes and make sure this sort of tragedy does not happen again. Whether its JUSTICE for the 96 or JUSTICE for the 39 at Heysel ... we are all HUMAN and we make mistakes.

Salut I.J.

**footstep** · March 17th, 2012, 04:06 PM

History and historians will make the job as soon as many years will give enough in retrospect capacity of analysis that period of troubles.To give his opinion of disgust is usual BUT it doesn't give an explanation.Historians will do it.and the question is WHY?

**Greenman** · March 17th, 2012, 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IngramJohn

Unfortunately, FACTS will not bring these people back mate period!

FAULT: Margaret Thatcher? The Police? Kelvin McKenzie? Was there no fault of any Liverpool supporter trying to get into a game they did not have a ticket to watch? (or were late due to roadworks)?

JUSTICE: If you have lost your child/husband/wife in ANY disaster how will justice help these people? Will they sleep better at night? Will they suddenly become happy and satisfied? I think not.

Maybe, as horrible as I may sound, we should 'move on', learn by our mistakes and make sure this sort of tragedy does not happen again. Whether its JUSTICE for the 96 or JUSTICE for the 39 at Heysel ... we are all HUMAN and we make mistakes.

Salut I.J.

Undoubtedly there were far too many supporters trying to get in but I refer you to Wembley 1986 & 1989 when too many Everton and Liverpool supporters tried to get into the ground some even risking life and limb to be hauled inside up walls-the authorities should have known this could happen so they were to blame for that, but someone in the Police made a drastic error of judgement in opening a gate that should have remained closed and that was covered up as we now know. In the second instance, yes I am sure the families would love to be able to bring their loved ones back but as you say it's not possible but what they want is something to justify why it caused death -Justice is always wanted, to try to explain why something was allowed to happen either human or mechanical error, but if no one is brought to account it just becomes a waste of human life and that is the tragedy. Finally, I think Liverpool as a City will move on, the team have since then, but only once the full truth comes out. As for The Sun, well I doubt they will forgive that, but they certainly won't forget it either.

March 17th, 2012, 05:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greenman

Undoubtedly there were far too many supporters trying to get in but I refer you to Wembley 1986 & 1989 when too many Everton and Liverpool supporters tried to get into the ground some even risking life and limb to be hauled inside up walls-the authorities should have known this could happen so they were to blame for that, but someone in the Police made a drastic error of judgement in opening a gate that should have remained closed and that was covered up as we now know.

At Wembley, they were obviously all ticket games, so why can there be many too many people with tickets?? If they were all trying to get in at the same time, then the obvious thing to do would be to open another gate. But then in your next example that was wrong

Sorry, but those 2 cases seem to be in direct conflict with each other.

As for Hillsborough, I think only the people who were there will know the real truth, Liverpool and Forest fans. Ditto Heysel.

**Roger Allott** · March 17th, 2012, 05:41 PM

Fabrice Muamba, Bolton Wanderers' and Englanf U-21 midfielder, collapsed during the first half of the FA Cup QF against Spurs at WHL. BBC not reporting his condition other than to say it's very serious, but wikipedia is reporting that he has died.

**Roger Allott** · March 17th, 2012, 05:45 PM

Actually, his wiki page keeps on changing. It seems someone is editing it to say he's dead, but some others, perhaps with more taste, seem to be continually deleting these updates until there's some official word.

March 17th, 2012, 05:41 PM	#8339
Roger Allott Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 7,937 Thanks: 10,958 Thanked 155,877 Times in 8,000 Posts	Fabrice Muamba, Bolton Wanderers' and Englanf U-21 midfielder, collapsed during the first half of the FA Cup QF against Spurs at WHL. BBC not reporting his condition other than to say it's very serious, but wikipedia is reporting that he has died. __________________ *If you don't want your beliefs ridiculed, don't have ridiculous beliefs.*

March 17th, 2012, 05:45 PM	#8340
Roger Allott Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 7,937 Thanks: 10,958 Thanked 155,877 Times in 8,000 Posts	Actually, his wiki page keeps on changing. It seems someone is editing it to say he's dead, but some others, perhaps with more taste, seem to be continually deleting these updates until there's some official word. __________________ *If you don't want your beliefs ridiculed, don't have ridiculous beliefs.*

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March 17th, 2012, 09:14 AM	#8332
george anson Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Watford Posts: 8,749 Thanks: 21,772 Thanked 293,406 Times in 8,926 Posts	As we've discussed before until retrospective video punishment comes in coupled with severe penalties for cheats then the cheats will continue to prosper and this game will continue to be blighted by such appalling displays as from Drogba. It needn't all be one way either as players wrongly punished could have their penalties reversed too albeit too late to affect the outcome of the game. As for the Hillsborough news it's a very simple matter as history has shown time and time again for those who are actually culpable of the mistakes to pass the blame onto those who can longer speak and defend themselves. If there were indeed drunken fans as is claimed why did the police officers even allow them near the ground in the first place ? It is the FA Cup quarter final stage today and tomorrow. Unfortunately the Premier League seems to think as it is of course the best league in the world bar none that it should remain centre stage with a relatively full league programme. Very disappointing Napoli managed to lose their match as I am no fan of Chelsea from the owner to certain players in that side like Terry and Cole and the enormous number of gloryhunters who have become Chelsea fans over recent seasons. Benfica a club with infinitely richer history and traditions and acheivements are already being written off as cannon fodder. Nothing would give me greater pleasure to see the Eagles win. Guardiola has described Bielsa as the best coach in the world today. Pep used to travel down to Buenos Aires to discuss tactics and footballing philosophies for hours so unsurprising there is admiration between master and pupil. Barca's current tactics are those created by Bielsa a decade or more ago which unfortunately (requiring players at peak fitness) did not work in the 2002 WC for his Argentina who had between 2000-2002 swept aside everyone they had played. One saw this in the game on Thursday night. If players like Munain, Martinez and Llorente can stay at Bilbao they could become a very good team over the next few seasons. It is a remarkable transformation for a side that under Caparros played long ball in La Liga and a very physical game (a trait linked to their English heritage). Both Bilbao and Barcelona have close links having suffered under the fascist regime of Franco and seen as representatives of the Basque nation and Catalonia.

March 17th, 2012, 09:46 AM	#8333
buttsie Porn Archeologist Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: earth Posts: 12,714 Thanks: 92,252 Thanked 241,294 Times in 12,746 Posts	All rather strange this feigning injury and diving given some of the best exponents of it are playing in several of the more successful teams going around at the moment. Watching last seasons Real Madrid v Barcelona matches was like watching a bunch of actors training for a mock match in between the actual skilful playing of the ball. As one commentator online said recently when there's SO much money at stake we shouldn't be surprised at the depths players will stoop to to gain the advantage.

March 17th, 2012, 04:06 PM	#8336
footstep Lost luggages? Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: France Posts: 7,268 Thanks: 92,097 Thanked 86,760 Times in 7,170 Posts	History and historians will make the job as soon as many years will give enough in retrospect capacity of analysis that period of troubles.To give his opinion of disgust is usual BUT it doesn't give an explanation.Historians will do it.and the question is WHY?