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October 29th, 2012, 02:37 PM | #1011 |
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Nobody1,
Can't say as I know anything about either although I agree a lot with the Green Party (not familiar with SEP). Over the years I've mainly voted for third party candidates which is basically the same as throwing your vote away in the US. One of our real problems in the US is that third parties don't have a chance. But should. For the most part, right now, there really isn't that much of a difference between the two parties in what they actually do. A million miles apart in what they say, but maybe a quarter inch in what they actually do. And, I believe, that both parties have conspired to make it almost impossible for any third parties to do much of anything. If you'll remember, Ross Perot (whom I voted for twice), was the last third party rep. to have much of a chance. Will I vote for another third party candidate? Probably. And maybe even this year. But the only thing which may stop me is remembering that it was a third party candidate (Ralph Nader) that gave us GW Bush. |
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October 29th, 2012, 03:04 PM | #1012 | |
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Many people would probably disagree with me, but the closest the US has had to having a dictator would probably have been FDR, a Democrat. He had solid majorities in both houses of congress, but it took the supreme court to restrain him. The next one would probably be Abraham Lincoln, a Republican, because he arrested and imprisoned newspaper editors, suspended the Writ of Habeas Corpus, and other rights all under the authority of the President during war. The lust for sole power does not reside in only one political doctrine. |
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October 29th, 2012, 03:37 PM | #1013 |
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So , Did, Umm, Choice magazine have an article about the final chosen one
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October 29th, 2012, 03:57 PM | #1014 | |
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Estreeter,
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But, of course, the Supreme Court had a lot to do with Bush "winning" that election. All I'm really saying is that Nader sucked enough votes away from Gore to keep the election close. The Supreme Court did the rest. |
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October 29th, 2012, 04:02 PM | #1015 |
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Sorry, my pathetic attempt at humor...... I thought Ralph Nader started Choice magazine That consumer product advise Mag Maybe I was wro...... Slightly incorrect
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October 29th, 2012, 04:19 PM | #1016 |
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October 29th, 2012, 05:03 PM | #1017 | ||
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Greens, on the other hand, might. They don't have any great traction today, but there are clearly folks who vote "Green". In general, though, minor third party candidates don't matter in the US. The experience of 1992 --when a Ross Perot candidacy cost Bush (41) his re election against Clinton, and 2000, when Ralph Nader likely cost Al Gore the election against Bush (43), has left both conservatives and liberals chastened. If you voted for Nader, and that helped elect Bush, you feel pretty awful about that. Here's what the head of the Sierra Club (major environmental organization) had to say about Nader Quote:
That's why 3rd party presidential candidates don't get more than a Youtube video today. |
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October 29th, 2012, 05:49 PM | #1018 | |
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Lincoln was in a different situation, fighting not merely a war, but also a civil war. In a civil war, what one side would consider freedom of speech will often appear to the other side as bare-faced treachery. I certainly recollect reading that Lincoln's man, John Dix, locked up well over 100 Maryland state legislators in May 1861 because they had convened in order to pass a motion of succession from the Union. Most of them stayed in clink until 1865. The Maryland state legisators who remained at liberty were the minority who had openly opposed succession. Quite pointedly, they passed a motion of loyalty and support to the Union but with an explicit statement that their state had a perfect right to succede from the Union any time it felt like it; they were pissed off about the high-handed action against their colleagues and wanted this fact to be on the record. I dare say neither Lincoln nor Dix lost any sleep on that score; they could afford to allow the Maryland senators to sound off.
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October 29th, 2012, 09:10 PM | #1019 | |
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palo5,
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And I do not understand about the expense. In the US there can be no expense (except maybe transportation to the poll) to vote. Any expense is supposed to be considered a "poll tax" and thus illegal. For years after the Civil War many of the Southern states used to come up with all kinds of reasons to keep blacks from voting. Finally sometime in the 1960's (I believe) these practices were made illegal. Republicans have been doing their utmost for the last two years to bring those laws back but, so far, they've pretty much been beaten back. But the Republicans keep trying. They've been putting up billboards in Milwaukee and Cleveland in mainly minority districts trying to intimidate minority voters. For the most part they've been forced to take them down but I'm sure they've intimidated a few people who won't vote. |
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October 29th, 2012, 09:42 PM | #1020 |
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I think Palo meant that the expense is for an independent campaign. Sort of how Ross Perot dug into his own pocket to pay his. Didn't read it to mean that voters had to pony up if they wanted to vote for anyone else.
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