Militant Islamists

[Brecht]

Seriously, vannax, you shouldn't be using terms you don't understand. You obviously have no idea what a commie is, otherwise you wouldn't think someone like Estreeter is one. In order to understand what communism is, you'll have to pick up a couple of books and not the ones with pictures I'm afraid. You watch a couple of videos on Youtube, read some articles on far right websites that only confirm your already existing prejudices and you think you've gathered all the wisdom in the world. Your worldview is just black and white but that's not what the world looks like. The West was either supporting Islamic fundamentalists in their effort to subvert and destabilize secular governments in the Arab world or directly intervening like in the case of Iraq. The invasion of Iraq resulted with the collapse of its civil society and social structure. People lost their homes, their savings and even their future. You take away their basis of existence and you nurture the possibility of crime and extremism. This is especially true for conservative societies, despite their governments being secular. Saddam Hussein may have been a dictator but there was no sectarianism and people weren't blowing each other up twice a week. Western governments have been supporting Islamic fanatics for decades, from Afghanistan to Libya. Look what's happening in the US and soem parts of Europe. Whenever the average Joe thinks his right to the annual Super Bowl barbecue is under threat, he goes berserk. But in the Arab world and most of the Third World, people are losing everything and you ask yourself why many of them end up in the wacko world of Achmed the Dead Terrorist.

[Arturo2nd]

Originally Posted by luca3434

What do you think would happen to a muslim woman in an islamic country who opened her legs and showed her pussy for a Readers Wives-type publication?

For those who are just dying to research this matter further, I offer you this.

http://vintage-erotica-forum.com/sho...ostcount=19752

[otokonomidori]

Originally Posted by Brecht

Seriously, vannax, you shouldn't be using terms you don't understand. You obviously have no idea what a commie is, otherwise you wouldn't think someone like Estreeter is one. In order to understand what communism is, you'll have to pick up a couple of books and not the ones with pictures I'm afraid. You watch a couple of videos on Youtube, read some articles on far right websites that only confirm your already existing prejudices and you think you've gathered all the wisdom in the world. Your worldview is just black and white but that's not what the world looks like. The West was either supporting Islamic fundamentalists in their effort to subvert and destabilize secular governments in the Arab world or directly intervening like in the case of Iraq. The invasion of Iraq resulted with the collapse of its civil society and social structure. People lost their homes, their savings and even their future. You take away their basis of existence and you nurture the possibility of crime and extremism. This is especially true for conservative societies, despite their governments being secular. Saddam Hussein may have been a dictator but there was no sectarianism and people weren't blowing each other up twice a week. Western governments have been supporting Islamic fanatics for decades, from Afghanistan to Libya. Look what's happening in the US and soem parts of Europe. Whenever the average Joe thinks his right to the annual Super Bowl barbecue is under threat, he goes berserk. But in the Arab world and most of the Third World, people are losing everything and you ask yourself why many of them end up in the wacko world of Achmed the Dead Terrorist.

I'd read this with interest if you'd use paragraphs.

[Estreeter]

Originally Posted by vannax

1. It is us and them. That's how war works. If you don't think its us and them, then you clearly don't think its a war, either that, or your understanding of English isn't your strong suit.
2. Islam doesn't need me to drive a wedge between us and them, they do that all by themselves by raping and killing.
3. I have told my Muslim co-workers my opinion. Their response: "I'm Shia, those are Sunnis". I guess that they to are driving wedges between Sunni and the west, eh?
4. The terrorists want to impose Sharia, I want to resist them. You, on the other hand, say that by calling out the ideology of Sharia (aka Islam) is aiding and abetting the terrorists whose desire it is to impose Sharia. That's plain insane.
5. I Expect you will now jump to the defense of the KKK members and neo-NAZIs who are innocent of any crime. No? Why not? You appear ready to jump to the defense of proponents of Sharia who haven't committed any crime, so why not the KKK members or neo-NAZI's?

Well excuse me vannax, Let me correct you where you have not read my thoughts correctly

On your point 1.
I brought up us and them attitude, It is us and them, but my them means terrorists and it is a war with them, I have no problem with Muslims in general, you seem to and just add to that attitude where someone who feels alienated in the Muslim community could just tip the wrong way

On your point 2,
You're correct, Islam don't need you to drive a wedge between Us and the, so stop making your posts seem anti Islam in general.

On your point 3
Yes, I do now recall you saying that.

On your point 4
Never once did I say or ever will say I want Sharia Law, Fact is I don't want it ... but do all Muslims want it ??? I don't know many Muslims but of those I know they feel embarrassed by ISIS and it's brutality.

On your point 5
I posted this the other day elsewhere on the forum

Originally Posted by Estreeter

Assassinations

1. Martin Luther King
2.

Almost to the day of the anniversary of Dr King's slaying, please don't ever even think I'm close to the thinking of KKK or have any sympathetic view to them. As for Nazi's well I'm a bit more intelligent to get involved in a discussion about them, if only you knew my family history during WW1 and 2.

Seriously vannax, you seem to have a lot to say yet offer no solutions. I've none myself and I honestly do not envy the position of powerful world leaders, often they're put in the damned if you do and damned if you don't situation. People like you will complain about what they did or didn't do in the Middle East.... well, what would you do ??? Me, I wouldn't have a fucking clue on how to solve what goes on there, but driving that wedge between the everyday peaceful Muslim and "Us" I won't do.

Originally Posted by diamelsx

OK question:why is always the "others" that get painted as the rapists? We can go back to blacks at the end of Reconstruction to the Latinos and Muslims of today it is always put out there that the minority group is a bunch rapists like the accusers hands would be clean in that arena. Again I am not just talking Muslims here just a pattern I noticed in general.

Exactly

Originally Posted by Brecht

You obviously have no idea what a commie is, otherwise you wouldn't think someone like Estreeter is one.

OK, I'll admit it, once in a while I do have a leftist view on certain things

Originally Posted by Brecht

Whenever the average Joe thinks his right to the annual Super Bowl barbecue is under threat, he goes berserk.

Exactly, nothing like getting your views across using fear.
Same has happened here, the far right idiots saying we're gonna be invaded and blah blah blah, Sharia Law will be imposed

Originally Posted by otokonomidori

I'd read this with interest if you'd use paragraphs.

Maybe Brecht could read it for ya like a Mum would read a story to her child in a cot

[Brecht]

Originally Posted by Estreeter

Maybe Brecht could read it for ya like a Mum would read a story to her child in a cot

Or maybe I should publish my views in a comic book, so certain folks can read them.

[ballyhoo]

Originally Posted by vannax

As it is, this place is full of....

porn. P-O-R-N. this place is full of porn!

using VEF as a platform for posting daily rants is kind of like saying you subscribe
to Playboy just to read the many interesting articles, and observe the fashion tips.

I'd say 100% of the members here would agree that the actions of these extreme
groups are wrong! however, your continual non-stop venting won't change anything.
we all know what your views are. Helen Keller's ghost knows what your views are.

you're like a broken record. except your record only has one side. and it's not an LP
it's a 45. I don't even have the option to flip the fekkin' thing over and listen to Beth.
it truly boggles my mind to think of all the time and energy you must put into this.

I'm all for voicing opinions, and freedom of speech. but here's my question for you;
at what point do you finally feel like you've accomplished your goal of making the
World a safer place by constantly spewing your venomous hatred out here at VEF?

to be perfectly honest, people like you scare me more than the evil "bad guys" do.

[seany65]

Sorry to butt in here, but having read:

'Posted by Estreeter:

"On your point 4
Never once did I say or ever will say I want Sharia Law, Fact is I don't want it ... but do all Muslims want it ??? I don't know many Muslims but of those I know they feel embarrassed by ISIS and it's brutality." '

I had to ask 2 questions and make a statement.

Question 1:

Estreeter, do you really believe that they'd all tell you if they wanted sharia law to be brought in, given that most westerners aren't muslim and don't like the idea of living under sharia law and many westerners are being "radicalised" into hating islam by the islamic terrorists themselves (and not just 'anti-muslim' rhetoric by the right wing westerners)?

Statement:

I don't believe that Sharia Law is the same as the brutality of ISIS.

What isis do can be (and has been) done by many people in lots of countries, with political or religious motivation.

Sharia law is a (vicious) law code that is meant to 'help' people live 'righteous' lives and thus help them get into heaven.

Question 2:

Have you noticed that your muslim acquaintances do not say they don't want to live under sharia law, they merely distract you by saying they are embarassed by the brutality of isis?

"Embarassed by isis and it's brutality"?

Shouldn't they be disgusted? Shouldn't they feel it's a disgrace to islam and muslims?

[Estreeter]

Originally Posted by seany65

Sorry to butt in here, but having read:

No need to be sorry.

This is what I know as fact,
Living in Melbourne there is quite a large Muslim community, the only ones I personally know up here I work or have worked with, all except for one of the dozen or so appear normal by western customs.

My hometown itself when growing up there wasn't much of a Muslim population. I grew up with one kid who is Muslim who has Bosnian roots, He's the one I was referring to, he did use the word embarrassed and knowing him my whole life I'm sure it was the word he used at the time and I'm sure he is disgusted also. He leads a western lifestyle, takes his kids to football and all those type things we consider our lifestyle and has always mixed in well and us with him and his family.

There's also a small Turk and Lebanese community in my hometown, some I know personally also, One in particular is a very popular restaurant owner, the kind of bloke who knows everyone and has always been polite. About 2 years ago there was an idiot from here that went back to fight with ISIS, he had his kid with him, the kid was holding a severed head. That image was on the front page of our newspapers. I happened to be in his establishment the day that was shown and the place wasn't real busy. He came over to say hello and saw I was reading the paper with that article, His words .... The world needs to see this and what these animals do...... He didn't need to say more, I could see the anger in his face, I didn't say anything and we left it at that, then went on and talked about when I was coming home for good.

I guess the Muslims who are normal by our standards feel all kinds of things.
When I see and know Muslims like those that I've known for decades and just want to go about their own lives I feel for them when they have to put up with vile comments that generalise and put them all in the same basket.

[otokonomidori]

Originally Posted by Brecht

Or maybe I should publish my views in a comic book, so certain folks can read them.

Certainly - a comic by all means - if you consider your views laughable?

Otherwise paragraphs will be fine.

[Arturo2nd]

Originally Posted by seany65

Sharia law is a (vicious) law code that is meant to 'help' people live 'righteous' lives and thus help them get into heaven.

Have you noticed that your muslim acquaintances do not say they don't want to live under sharia law, they merely distract you by saying they are embarassed by the brutality of isis?

I am not willing to spend time looking it up, but I have previously posted an article noting that most Muslims are not in favor of adopting sharia.

This is to be expected. We do not find Jews adopting the barbaric code of the Old Testament. Routine public hangings, beheadings, floggings, etc. are no longer practiced in Western nations. Our churches are no longer allowed to burn heretics at the stake. We are fortunate in our first world countries not to live in circumstances where those who love to rape, maim, and kill are suppressed and the followers are not encouraged to emulate them. Much of the world is not so lucky.