Communism. Good or bad. What do you really know about Communism?

[Enrico32]

Originally Posted by deepsepia

They are very clear that the reason Caesar was killed was that he was a tyrant . . .

Do you personally think Caesar was a tyrant?

He disobeyed Senate and then went around with his own private army. Such behavior was exhibited by very many Roman generals.

Could we conclude from such behavior that Roman society was based more on persona than on explicitly impersonal law? But later Italians stopped running around with private armies. Did the morals change?
Who changes the morals? [this is very important to understand why some countries are tyrannies while others think of liberty as of something natural]

[deepsepia]

Originally Posted by Enrico32

Do you personally think Caesar was a tyrant?

He disobeyed Senate and then went around with his own private army. Such behavior was exhibited by very many Roman generals.

He destroyed the Republic and took all power for himself.

No one had done that before him. There had been people like Sulla before Caesar, but I don't think anyone thinks that Sulla was a great guy . . .

[Roubignol]

What Capitalist fans here do not understand or do not want to mention is that Capitalism systematically push to monopolies that almost are like the single party "fake liberals" (because a liberal uses money like a whip, like handcuffs) a pretend to fight.

Here is an recent Oxfam report.

26 Billionaires Own The Same Wealth As The Poorest 3.8 Billion People

A new economic system is needed to tackle rampant inequality, says a new Oxfam report.


A report published this week by the Institute for Policy Studies, a left-leaning Washington, D.C., think tank, found that the 400 richest Americans own more wealth than all black households and a quarter of Latino households.


That's what you defend.

The extreme rich people only want one thing, that poorest ones consume to make them richer. Finally they become stronger than government themselves, hide taxes and pushing to consuming, destroy the environement.

That's terribly nihilistic.

[Dirk]

Is there really not a single black or latino household in that top 400?

[Roubignol]

Originally Posted by bowlinggreen

According to xyz's Soviet constitution, such people were to be allowed to remain on their land.

It's not according to me. It was written in Soviet Constitution.

Here is the "Bucknell university" 1936 CONSTITUTION OF THE USSR

What you don't want to understand, it's that your "greedy billionaire masters" told lies about history. You probably never had to compare the Soviet Constitution to the American one. I wasn't better educated than yourself, because I never had to compare the Soviet one with the Swiss one.

What your politicians called "freedom", was a lie. You had the impression to be free, but wasn't. You had to serve billionaires interests who paid your politicians to wrote the laws that push you to destroy the environment of your children and your nephews, that push you to wake up for a job that you maybe didn't like that much.

I already published in this forum the critic of the German ideology by Karl Marx.
What wanted Marx? He said: "Ok guys, you will have to sometimes do unfunny jobs to survive, but then you will be more free."

Even Keynes said that when he saved American economy.

I’m the future, though, at least according to John Maynard Keynes’s 1930 prediction that by 2030 we’d all be working just 15 hours per week, what with all the industrial and technological advances, leaving us puzzling how to fill our gaping leisure time.

Do you work 15 hours per week?

Originally Posted by Dirk

Is there really not a single black or latino household in that top 400?

400 minus 1 or 2 or 3 = 399, 398, 397 ~ 400

Originally Posted by bowlinggreen

I assume he means that the intellectuals drew up documents for "real" communism, and Stalin and the legions of apparatchiks turned it into "fake" communism.

Which further proves the point that 'real" communism can only exist inside the heads of those sipping coffee in the Marx and Engels Café.

This brings us to another point. is there "real" capitalism and "fake" capitalism? How would you tell the difference?

Stalin thought that Karl Marx philosophy had to be promotted through a coercitive way. Stalin was anti-anarchist. It's interesting to read what he wrote when he was 25 years old.

But as it was explained by several Marx specialists, Lenin and Stalin didn't know all the writtings of Karl Marx and Engels.

David Ryazanov, the Russian editor who published the 1844 Manuscripts in 1932 will be condemned later to death for "treason" by Stalin, with, as evidence, the publication of the manuscript in question ... A further proof, if it still needs, the gap that has always separated the philosophy original of Marx what the USSR did

[Roubignol]

Originally Posted by Estreeter

I look at it like this,
There is no real or fake, only what's existed If it never existed it can't be real or fake.

The commie supporters here will never bring up the good capitalists, it would kill them to admit there is good and bad in both systems.

Just read Marx. Marx said that Capitalism was extremely efficient.
A lot of Communists leaders entered in the UE parliament. They observed that Capitalism brought more improvement than fake Communism (Socialism in fact). Sadly greed and whims are a good intellectual motor for classical human brain.

The problem today, is that environmentally speaking, state or liberal Capitalisms are harmful, because nihililistic billionaires manipulate politicians thanks to money to write laws to avoid environmental protection.

Just read the facts: billion of plastic bottles in ocean, no more fishes, no more big mammals, even insects population collapsing, no more real nature.

That's all the fault of shareholders and pension funds.
Grandfathers today destroy the future of their grandchildren to get their pensions thanks to Capitalist economy.

I can't understand how an uncle like you can defend this predatorous economic system?

Originally Posted by Enrico32

In official Marxist theory, communism grows out of capitalism.

Communism = improved capitalism.
Planned economy, for example, was predicted as an outgrowth of monopolies. Workers' control of industries was predicted as an outgrowth of trade-unions.
Remember Lenin's Development of Capitalism in Russia.

Exactly. Marx thought that Capitalism still was a primitive form of economy for people who were unable to collaborate together spontaneously.

[scoundrel]

Originally Posted by xyzde69

It's not according to me. It was written in Soviet Constitution.

Here is the "Bucknell university" 1936 CONSTITUTION OF THE USSR

I've mentioned this before but your bizarre fascination with the Soviet constitution of 1936 forces me to revisit the point.

Scene - a bordello on the wild west frontier in West Texas.
Roy Bean: The Constitution of the State of Texas? What's that doing here?
Brothel-Keeper: It's for the whores to piss on.

~The Life and Times of Judge Roy Bean (1972)

[Roubignol]

Originally Posted by scoundrel

I've mentioned this before but your bizarre fascination with the Soviet constitution of 1936 forces me to revisit the point.


~The Life and Times of Judge Roy Bean (1972)

I speak French. In France today, the yellow Vests are asking to the French government to get the right to tell what they think their future, laws and governements through referendums like Swiss or Californian citizen.

The guy who promotted that is a professor of economy called "Etienne Chouard", who was disgusted when Sarkozy didn't respect French population vote about Maastrich.

I've listened and read a lot "Chouard's" works and speeches.
One day he said: "Just read the 1936 USSR Constitution. It's incredible. Why didn't we learn that at school."

I read it and was impressed.
If we get institutions that push leaders to respect this constitution, that's without any doubt one of the best Constitutions written.

I read Deepsepia fears and improved it.
I made it like Swiss democracy. I'm proud about this improved form of Constitution. I really think that UK people must read it.

[bowlinggreen]

Originally Posted by xyzde69

Just read the facts: billion of plastic bottles in ocean, no more fishes, no more big mammals, even insects population collapsing, no more real nature.

As I have said before, this has nothing to do with any government type, it has to do with the fact that there are too many people on earth.

If population growth continues, then one day the chickens will come home to roost, it will all collapse, and billions will starve.

Estreeter, being in Australia, will probably end up adopting a Mad Max sort of lifestyle, cruising around in a desertified Charger and eating wallabies and the occasional carefully hoarded can of corned beef. I hope he has had the foresight to stash some now illegal firearms.

The people you hate will see their fortunes vanish but they'll probably survive, having the means to acquire food hoards in the early days of famine.

The peasants you must "love" as a "communist" will pretty much be gone in the great starvation event.

So you must choose which to put first, humanity or the rest of the ecosystem, because humanity is unlikely to change their blindly selfish overpopulating ways.

On the bright side, once most of the humans are gone, the ecosystem will recover - not that you'll be around to enjoy it.

[Estreeter]

Originally Posted by xyzde69

Just read the facts: billion of plastic bottles in ocean, no more fishes, no more big mammals, even insects population collapsing, no more real nature.

Originally Posted by bowlinggreen

As I have said before, this has nothing to do with any government type, it has to do with the fact that there are too many people on earth.

I think it has everything to do with people themselves being irresponsible and not discarding their waste correctly

I've never seen a sign Coca Cola made asking people to throw plastic bottles where they don't belong, I have seen many thousands of plastic bottles with advise printed on the label showing people how to dispose them correctly. I could go but won't, it's a bullshit argument to blame that on companies, that's just lazy and irresponsible idiots that cause that.