The First World War

[Mal Hombre]

I remember reading about Whippet tanks returning from a foray behind enemy lines-With Their tracks clogged with "Human Remains"....

[knobby109]

Originally Posted by scoundrel

We needed to re-learn this one in WW2. It was very late in, in the spring of 1945 that Britain finally had a really good heavy tank in the Comet and so rapid was the German retreat that soldiers struggled to keep up with the front. Many scrounged a lift off the tank boys (there was sitting room for at least a dozen men on the flat top of a Comet tank) and it was soon discovered that this was a terrific symbiosis. The lads got a free lift and took the weight off their feet. Then, whenever there was a hidden bend in the road, a blind summit or a suspicious copse of trees placed just perfectly for an anti-tank position, they jumped off and went round the flank to check it out before the tank came in from the front.

The Comet was arguably the best tank of WW2 but too late and too few to have any real effect. And the Centurion was nearly ready , entering service in June 1945.........

[squigg58]

Originally Posted by scoundrel

Didn't von Richtofen shoot down two enemy aircraft while serving as the observer on two-seaters, before training to be a pilot?

I only know of one, and it's never included in his list as it couldn't be confirmed. The Germans were actually quite picky when it came to claims!

All von Richthofen's 80 confirmed victories were when he was flying single-seaters.

Originally Posted by Mal Hombre

Also, One of His victories was actually Future British ace,James McCudden,Who when His Gun jammed,Flipped His DH2 upsidedown and spun away to safety.He righted His 'plane ,Cleared the jam and returned to the fray,Only to find everybody had gone.

One of Richthofen's claims was for "a pusher" on the 27th December 1916. McCudden's squadron did engage with Jasta 2 that day, and it has been suggested that the claim was for McCudden. However, it's also suggested that von Richthofen's claim referred to an F.E.2b. of 11 Squadron.

[squigg58]

Originally Posted by squigg58

One of Richthofen's claims was for "a pusher" on the 27th December 1916. McCudden's squadron did engage with Jasta 2 that day, and it has been suggested that the claim was for McCudden. However, it's also suggested that von Richthofen's claim referred to an F.E.2b. of 11 Squadron.

I've been doing a bit more digging.

Apparently, von Richthofen's combat report for that date is as follows:

At 1615, five planes of our Staffel attacked enemy Squadron south of Arras. The enemy approached our lines but were thrown back. After some fighting I managed to attack a very courageously flown Vickers two-seater. After 300 shots, the enemy plane began dropping, uncontrolled. I pursued the plane up to 1,000 metres above the ground. Enemy plane crashed to ground on enemy side, one kilometre behind trenches near Ficheux.
Weather: Mist in the morning, clearing later.

So, von Richthofen attacked a Vickers two-seater (not just "a pusher" as I believed earlier), and McCudden was flying a DH.2. I would struggle to accept that von Richthofen couldn't tell the difference as he'd encountered both aircraft, and shot down doth types, prior to the 27th December encounter. Bear in mind that even if we ignore the number of crew, the DH.2 had a wingspan of 8.61m, and the F.E.2b had a wingspan of 14.55m!

McCudden states that he was attacked by an Albatros D.II with leader's streamers on it. However, my understanding is that von Richthofen didn't lead Jasta 2. At the time of the combat, it would have been Franz Walz, and he wasn't credited with a victory on that date. However, I can't determine if Walz was actually flying that day, so von Richthofen may have been leading Jasta 2. However, even if that had been the case, I don't know if he'd have been entitled to have "leader's streamers" on his plane. (More digging required!)

With regard to the F.E.2b of 11 Squadron, it also seems unlikely that von Richthofen would have claimed that victory as that aircraft, crewed by Quested and Dicksee, was attacked by Wilhelm Cymera. The F.E.2b was forced down behind Allied lines so Cymera was not officially credited with the victory. Cymera's combat report gives the time of the combat as 12.20 (which ties in with the report from Quested and Dicksee) but von Richthofen's claim was for a victory several hours later ... and in a different place!

There are no official mentions of an F.E.2b being lost which tie in with von Richthofen's claim, so that one will probably have to go down as an unsolved mystery.

However, as the German system for crediting victories was somewhat strict, it's quite likely that von Richthofen shot down more than 80 aircraft anyway, so ones that actually got away, and unconfirmed victories, probably balance out in the long run.

[Ennath]

November 24, 1914
Eastern Front Russian reinforcements at Lodz restore the line and save the army there from defeat. Heavy fighting continues.
War at Sea The pre-dreadnought battleship Bulwark blows up in the Medway with the loss of 800 men. Foul play is suspected. In fact, the ship had been taking on ammunition and it is now believed that the shells were stacked too close together and too close to the boiler, causing some to ignite and cause a magazine explosion.

November 24, 1915
Eastern Front The Russians capture Yanopol, in the Dvinsk sector, turning a German flank. The Germans abandon their salient here.
Serbian Front The government moves to Scutari, Albania.
Mesopotamia Marshal von der Goltz arrives to take command of Turkish forces.

November 24, 1916
Russia Boris Sturmer resigns as Premier, at the Tsar’s urging. Alexander Trepov succeeds him. Some urge that Protopopov be removed as Interior Minister; he had been compromised by holding discussions with a German industrialist during a visit to Stockholm.
Russian Command Chief of Staff Alexeev suffers an apparent heart attack; he has been ill for some time and missed several staff meetings. He is forced to recuperate in the Crimea for four months. V. I. Gurko assumes temporary control.

November 24, 1917
Western Front There is fierce fighting at Bourlon village and Wood. The British gain at Bullecourt and Queant. The French make a small, successful attack on the Verdun front.
Italian Front Austrian attacks at Asiago and on the lower Piave are unsuccessful. Plumer is appointed to command British forces in Italy.
British Command General Sir William R. Marshall assumes command in Mesopotamia.
Russia Trotsky begins publishing Russia’s secret treaties with the other Allies, revealing goals of territorial aggrandizement and other dubious purposes. Trotsky had discovered copies of the agreements at the Foreign Ministry.

November 24, 1918
Germany Soviets in Oldenburg, East Friesland, Bremen, Harburg, Hamburg and Schleswig-Holstein decide to form a republic, with Hamburg as its capital. The Grand Duke of Baden abdicates.

November 24, 1929
France Georges Clemenceau dies at the age of 88.

[knobby109]

I read somewhere a long time ago that von Richtofen insisted in "finishing off" stricken Allied aircraft in order to increase his score.

[squigg58]

Originally Posted by knobby109

I read somewhere a long time ago that von Richtofen insisted in "finishing off" stricken Allied aircraft in order to increase his score.

I've asked Santa for Under The Guns Of The Red Baron for Christmas, so it'll be interesting to see which (if any) of the myths & legends are true ... or at least documented!

[Ennath]

November 25, 1914
Eastern Front Three German divisions are nearly encircled at Lodz, but escape due to delay by Rennenkampf. General Schaeffer smashes his way out of the trap, taking 10,000 prisoners. The Battle of Lodz comes to a close; while technically a Russian victory, it is a strategic success for the Germans as the Russian offensive is called off. Russian casualties have been about 80,000, German 35,000. Russian cavalry raid in Hungary.
Poland The Polish National Council issues a manifesto emphasizing the need for a thorough defeat of Germany.

November 25, 1915
Macedonia Salonika is to be built up as an Allied base.
British Command Admiral de Robeck leaves the Dardanelles for England. Admiral Wemyss takes charge.
Mesopotamia After two days of futile efforts to dislodge the Turks at Ctesiphon, Townshend concedes failure and orders a retreat to Lajj. The Turks have achieved a “strategic defeat with far-reaching effects”. Nixon has overreached in his desire to capture Baghdad, 20 miles beyond Ctesiphon. The Turks push their advantage and pursue the retreating British.
United States The Ku Klux Klan is revived in Atlanta. It will peak in the 1920’s with strength all over the country, extending its anti-black campaigns to include immigrants, Catholics and Jews. It goes into a slow decline in the 1930’s.
World Affairs Einstein presents his conclusive paper on General Relativity to the Prussian Academy of Sciences.

November 25, 1916
Rumanian Front There is fighting along the Arges River. Rimnik is occupied.

November 25, 1917
Western Front German counterattacks at Bourlon regain part of the village.
Italian Front The Austrians continue their fruitless attacks between the Brenta and Piave.
Albania The Austrians press their attacks, forcing a crossing of the Osum during the night.
Palestine Mounted troops take Ain Karim, 4 miles from Jerusalem.
Portuguese East Africa The Germans enter Portuguese East Africa, crossing the Rovuma River. The force now numbers 2200. They immediately confront 1000 Portuguese at Negomano and severely defeat them, capturing all the supplies the Portuguese have brought.
War in the Air Surviving sometimes harrowing difficulties on the return trip, the L-59 arrives safely in Bulgaria. After four days in the air, the ship still has enough fuel left for three more days of flying. Although her mission was aborted, the L-59 has achieved the first intercontinental flight and also the longest sustained flight on record – being airborne for 95 hours and flying 4220 miles without interruption.
Russia Kaledin captures Rostov, executing Red leaders.

November 25, 1918
Britain Parliament dissolves in preparation for a general election.
Germany Hoping to obtain Allied food aid for Bavaria, Eisner tries to distance himself from the Prussian regime. Aware that the Allies are looking for “ammunition” to blame the war on the Germans, and thinking he would be rewarded for providing it, Eisner releases the reports of the Bavarian Legation in Berlin during the days leading to the war. It is a political bombshell. While the Allies are happy to get the information, they refuse to play Eisner’s game; Bavaria will get no special treatment. The rest of Germany now loathes him. Bavarians feel disturbed at selling other Germans down the river. The Social Democrats are livid that he failed to consult the party leadership. For those on the right, it is proof that Eisner the Jew is a Bolshevik in disguise, while the left sees it as proof that he is no revolutionary and is in league with the capitalist nations.
Yugoslavia The Montenegrin assembly votes for union with Serbia.
Northern Rhodesia The last of the schutztruppe, led by Lettow-Vorbeck, march into Abercorn before noon. Before an honor guard in the town square, Lettow-Vorbeck has his men form in three ranks, salutes the British flag, and reads his surrender statement, first in German and then in English. He surrenders an army of 155 Europeans and 1168 askaris, along with 3000 other Africans. After the surrender, British officers and troops express their admiration to the defeated commander and his men. With a force never exceeding 6000, he has tied down 130,000 Allied troops.

[Ennath]

November 26, 1914
Western Front German attacks on Missy-sur-Aisne and along the Yser are repulsed.
War at Sea Churchill orders the development of Q-Ships, merchantmen with concealed guns to surprise surfaced U-Boats.
Austria-Hungary Franz Josef rejects Conrad’s proposal to impose military rule on Bohemia, Moravia and Silesia.

November 26, 1915
Italian Front The Italians attack at Tolmino, at the north end of the Isonzo front. New attacks go in against Oslavia and Podgora.
Persia The Russians defeat a Turkish and Kurdish force, occupying Karaj and Yengi Iman, 40 miles from Teheran.

November 26, 1916
War at Sea The pre-dreadnought Suffren is torpedoed off Portugal by U-52.
Rumanian Front Mackensen and Falkenhayn link up at Alexandria.
Macedonia French and Serbian troops take Hill 1050, 7 miles north of Monastir.
German East Africa A German force surrenders at Ilembule.

November 26, 1917
Italian Front A sharp Austrian attack is repulsed in the Brenta valley.
Palestine After being taken prisoner while reconnoitering disguised as an Arab and being savagely treated in Dera’a – his identity was not discovered – T. E. Lawrence managed to escape. He now arrives back at Aqaba in poor physical condition.

November 26, 1918
Belgium The last German troops leave the country.
Yugoslavia The union of Montenegro with Yugoslavia is proclaimed.
Russia Soviet troops following the retreating Germans take Pskov and Dvinsk.
Black Sea Allied fleets reach Odessa and Sevastopol. The Germans surrender the ex-Russian ships in their hands. These are turned over to the White Russians.

[Ennath]

November 27, 1875
Diplomatic Relations The British government acquires a controlling interest in the Suez Canal, completed in 1869.

November 27, 1914
United States President Wilson condemns the bombardment of unfortified towns.
Eastern Front Hindenburg is promoted Field Marshal. General Litvinov replaces Rennenkampf.

November 27, 1915
Western Front There is further fighting for the Labyrinth.
Rumania Precautionary mining of the Danube begins.

November 27, 1916
War in the Air Zeppelins raid the Midlands. Four are killed and two airships are brought down.
Rumanian Front The Bulgarians take Giurgevo. The Rumanians abandon the Aluta line.
Macedonia The Allied offensive ends. The troops are worn out and at the limits of their logistical ability.
French Command Briand promises to reverse the December 1915 creation of the office of commander in chief, separating out the Balkan armies and reducing Joffre to his former status as head of the armies of the north and northeast.
Russia The Tsar refuses a request by Trepov to dismiss Protopopov.

November 27, 1917
Western Front There is heavy fighting at Fontaine Notre Dame. The British line advance slightly, but Bourlon continues to hold and Haig cancels the offensive. The Germans are preparing a counterblow.
Eastern Front A note from General Max Hoffmann, commander of the German eastern forces, informs Krylenko that the Germans are ready to negotiate an armistice with Russia, designating Brest-Litovsk as the site for the talks.
Italian Front The Italians have successfully held Below’s troops along the entire Piave front, and now French and British troops are in place to bolster the defense. Three German divisions are recalled to the Western Front. The Caporetto offensive ends. It has cost the Italians 320,000 men, to 20,000 Austro-German, but the political and military situations now stabilize. On the Central Powers side, the battle has been a model of attack; had they possessed sufficient cavalry or armored cars to exploit their breakthrough, Italy might well have been knocked out of the war. The battle has been a military disaster for Italy, but the Italian public, which has so far been dubious about the war and its aims, is now rallied to a war of national defense. Anti-war demonstrations evaporate and even the socialists come on board. The Italian army begins a major change in tactics, which will reduce losses markedly. Austrian morale is buoyed by the victory, but high morale cannot compensate for the empire’s material shortages.
Palestine The Turks begin six days of counterattacks against Nebi Samwil Ridge, all unsuccessful.
German East Africa Over 2200 German and native troops surrender near Newala, believing themselves abandoned by Lettow-Vorbeck.
War at Sea Brazil concludes an agreement with France for the use of 30 interned German ships to carry food supplies to the Allies.

November 27, 1919
Diplomatic Relations The Treaty of Neuilly establishes peace with Bulgaria and sets reparations. Bulgaria loses its Adriatic coastline and the army is limited to 20,000 men.