Windows 10? - Page 54

**m100** · November 5th, 2015, 09:54 AM

i don't think the forum will allow me to link directly to the site but here in the uk i managed to find a brand new win 7 (with 8.1 discs included though not installed) without any trouble. so maybe if your machine breaks this week/month don't assume you are going to be stuck with buying something you don't want.

**Ernesto75** · November 5th, 2015, 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick Danger

Caution mon ami! All updates are not the same. In our haste to prevent Microsoft from "helping" us to upgrade to Windows 10, please make sure not to turn a blind eye to legitimate, security related updates, whether they be from Apple, Adobe, or yes, even Microsoft.
/

Well yes you are right.

I am grumbling but I nevertheless upgraded my iPhone to their OS 9.1 after upgrading my Itunes version.
Similarly I upgraded my Adobe products.

This is because security becomes more and more actual.

But it is infurating to be depending more and more, for our work or our pleasure, from the people at Microsoft which I distrust more and more.

To have me change my negative opinion on them they really have to work hard.

**Ernesto75** · November 5th, 2015, 03:57 PM

Susan Bradley's petition has reached 5 269 signatures.

Two weeks ago when I joined there were only 4 800 signatures.

**m100** · November 5th, 2015, 06:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ernesto75

Well yes you are right.

I am grumbling but I nevertheless upgraded my iPhone to their OS 9.1 after upgrading my Itunes version.
Similarly I upgraded my Adobe products.

This is because security becomes more and more actual.

But it is infurating to be depending more and more, for our work or our pleasure, from the people at Microsoft which I distrust more and more.

To have me change my negative opinion on them they really have to work hard.

this might sound harsh and please don't take it the wrong way but i really don't believe they are interested in changing your, mine or anyone's opinion who has the foresight to question their actions and motivations. I think they possibly see those who do as potential customers for apple, linux etc. Microsoft are more interested in the casual, mainstream buyer who will go into a big retailer and believe whatever nonsense the first salesperson who comes up to them tells them about how good windows 10 is or how as soon as they get their windows 8 machine home they should immediately avail themselves of the free upgrade.

**Ernesto75** · November 5th, 2015, 08:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m100

this might sound harsh and please don't take it the wrong way but i really don't believe they are interested in changing your, mine or anyone's opinion who has the foresight to question their actions and motivations. I think they possibly see those who do as potential customers for apple, linux etc. Microsoft are more interested in the casual, mainstream buyer who will go into a big retailer and believe whatever nonsense the first salesperson who comes up to them tells them about how good windows 10 is or how as soon as they get their windows 8 machine home they should immediately avail themselves of the free upgrade.

You seem to be even more pessimistic than me.

**Ernesto75** · November 5th, 2015, 08:26 PM

A few years ago I was in the habit of going to the presentations of their products.
At the end you had to answer a few questions.

I perfectly remember one where they asked 'Is your opinion about Microsoft changed ?'

There had been a legal affair for which they were condemned to pay one million dollars.

**Ernesto75** · November 5th, 2015, 09:23 PM

Here is the content of the petition sent to Microsoft's CEO by Susan Bradley (total is now of 5 313 signatures):

To effectively implement and use Windows 10 in our homes and businesses, Microsoft must make changes to both the operating system and the policies the company put in place to support the new OS. Those changes fall into two categories:
1) Microsoft must give Windows 10 users more control over when updates are installed. We need the ability to delay or hide damaging updates that impact the computing experience, have undesirable side effects such as blue screens of death, or reduce the functionality to attached devices. Under the current system of mandated updates, we have been adversely impacted by forced driver and firmware updates plus other patches; we've wasted hours dealing with the unwanted side effects. As long-time Windows users, we understand the need to have quicker and more agile security updating. But this agility should not introduce additional risks to our systems. Windows 10 updates have already caused loss of system functionality, video and display issues, and other significant issues.
2) Microsoft should provide detailed information on what's in each update -- along with what system changes we should see with each cumulative-update release. We applaud the cumulative-update model, but the lack of documentation doesn't let us to perform the due diligence required for safely deploying and maintaining Windows 10 systems in our organizations.
We have expressed our concerns on the Uservoice feedback platform here and here. We now use change.org's petition platform to express our concerns more broadly.
We need control using our existing patching methodologies.
We need communication.
Sincerely,
Your Windows customers

**beutelwolf** · November 5th, 2015, 11:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m100

I think they possibly see those who do as potential customers for apple, linux etc. Microsoft are more interested in the casual, mainstream buyer who will go into a big retailer and ...

In some way that describes me. I like to go into a big retailer, pick a computer off the shelf, carry it home, plug it in at home and have it run at home without much trouble. I don't want to spend hours configuring the thing, etc. Besides, I'm using Windows at work, so know the thing pretty well.

But I can be computer savvy if I have to, and the recent W10 crapware saga has pissed me off almightily. Modest efforts on my part to keep the crapware out of my Windows 7 machine have not been successful, and as the performance of that machine has deteriorated over the years anyway I decided enough is enough, wipe the disk and install Linux. The thing has not been running as smoothly as this for years, if ever. My newer PC still runs W8.1, which is OK but for the stupid tiles.

The big retailer's non-choice of having Windows-Newest on everything that isn't a soft fruit has not stopped me in the past from buying the computers there - if eventually needed, I could replace the OS on the hard drive. However, with stories about W10 undermining that option as well, my next machine will not be running MS software, not even initially. That may mean that I have to buy on-line, and I won't be the only one. I doubt though the retailers will pick up on this initially.

**masque51** · November 6th, 2015, 07:44 PM

I installed the GWX Control Panel (which works fine). Later I tried to update my browser to Firefox 42. When I re-started FF, nothing happened. I still have FF 41. I wonder if the GWX Control Panel is responsible for this.

**Ernesto75** · November 6th, 2015, 09:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by masque51

I installed the GWX Control Panel (which works fine). Later I tried to update my browser to Firefox 42. When I re-started FF, nothing happened. I still have FF 41. I wonder if the GWX Control Panel is responsible for this.

I don't think you can blame the GWX Control Panel. It works fine and Firefox 42 also.

From what you say it seems Firefox did not upgrade.

Did you re-try with Firefox ?
It may be the problem is there simply.

November 5th, 2015, 03:57 PM	#533
Ernesto75 Vintage Member Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Planet Earth Posts: 1,106 Thanks: 12,732 Thanked 21,648 Times in 1,096 Posts	An update about Susan Bradley's petition Susan Bradley's petition has reached 5 269 signatures. Two weeks ago when I joined there were only 4 800 signatures.

November 5th, 2015, 09:23 PM	#537
Ernesto75 Vintage Member Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Planet Earth Posts: 1,106 Thanks: 12,732 Thanked 21,648 Times in 1,096 Posts	The petition Here is the content of the petition sent to Microsoft's CEO by Susan Bradley (total is now of 5 313 signatures): To effectively implement and use Windows 10 in our homes and businesses, Microsoft must make changes to both the operating system and the policies the company put in place to support the new OS. Those changes fall into two categories: 1) Microsoft must give Windows 10 users more control over when updates are installed. We need the ability to delay or hide damaging updates that impact the computing experience, have undesirable side effects such as blue screens of death, or reduce the functionality to attached devices. Under the current system of mandated updates, we have been adversely impacted by forced driver and firmware updates plus other patches; we've wasted hours dealing with the unwanted side effects. As long-time Windows users, we understand the need to have quicker and more agile security updating. But this agility should not introduce additional risks to our systems. Windows 10 updates have already caused loss of system functionality, video and display issues, and other significant issues. 2) Microsoft should provide detailed information on what's in each update -- along with what system changes we should see with each cumulative-update release. We applaud the cumulative-update model, but the lack of documentation doesn't let us to perform the due diligence required for safely deploying and maintaining Windows 10 systems in our organizations. We have expressed our concerns on the Uservoice feedback platform here and here. We now use change.org's petition platform to express our concerns more broadly. We need control using our existing patching methodologies. We need communication. Sincerely, Your Windows customers

November 6th, 2015, 07:44 PM	#539
masque51 Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 6,653 Thanks: 59,897 Thanked 488,445 Times in 6,661 Posts	Firefox and GWX I installed the GWX Control Panel (which works fine). Later I tried to update my browser to Firefox 42. When I re-started FF, nothing happened. I still have FF 41. I wonder if the GWX Control Panel is responsible for this.

November 5th, 2015, 09:54 AM	#531
m100 Vintage Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 1,505 Thanks: 5,110 Thanked 11,919 Times in 1,489 Posts	i don't think the forum will allow me to link directly to the site but here in the uk i managed to find a brand new win 7 (with 8.1 discs included though not installed) without any trouble. so maybe if your machine breaks this week/month don't assume you are going to be stuck with buying something you don't want.

November 5th, 2015, 08:26 PM	#536
Ernesto75 Vintage Member Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Planet Earth Posts: 1,106 Thanks: 12,732 Thanked 21,648 Times in 1,096 Posts	A few years ago I was in the habit of going to the presentations of their products. At the end you had to answer a few questions. I perfectly remember one where they asked 'Is your opinion about Microsoft changed ?' There had been a legal affair for which they were condemned to pay one million dollars.