The Football Thread

[Brecht]

Originally Posted by Motorboater

I'm sure the Liverpool fans are nice people if you got to know them personally...

They softened since Heysel.

[george anson]

Originally Posted by pierrelm

As for Argentina - isn't the core problem with their defence that no matter how they set themselves up, they are notably pedestrian?

The same thing was said at the last World Cup yet Sabella had them extremely well organized. They defended as a unit and of course they had Mascherano at the peak of his powers (and in my eyes the best five in the world at the time).

It also helps having Messi just being on the pitch as the opposition are always wary of over committing just in case he slips free.

The defence is solid out wide with Tagliafico and Ansaldi and centrally Otamendi is decent enough as is Fazio but only in a deep lying defence. They cannot afford to push up as they will be caught for pace.I imagine Tagliafico will be tasked to stay at home as cover with both Pavon & Meza and di Maria sinking into midfield as extra defenders much as Sampaoli did with Chile.

It is a pity German Pezzella who was outstanding for Fiorentina, a born leader and former u20 captain who took over in the recent tragic passing of Davide Astori is only on the reserve list behind Rojo.

Also omitted was Walter Kannemann of Gremio who has been exceptional over the last two seasons. He is an old school defender tough as nails and no nonsense and gets the job done. While Brazil picked his CB partner Geromel for Russia Kannemann was not unfortunately.

The problem with this defence will be the DM. Biglia is a passenger at the moment and Mascherano's legs are not what they were. Armani is the best goalkeeper outside of the top European leagues. His reflexes and shot stopping and coming for crosses are excellent but his handling can be a little suspect.

[buttsie]

Originally Posted by pierrelm

You've described Phil Jones perfectly. As for fullbacks, they rely on pace as a substitute for ability and judgement - Kyle Walker (as someone rightly observed on here, a modern Glenn Johnson) has the ability to be caught gawping, out of position, yet this gets conveniently glossed over.

Some of my favourite players to watch plied their trade in Italy in that remarkable period so well covered over here by Football Italia. As well as the previously- mentioned Maldini, I liked Benarrivo (Parma left back) who could scarcely get a look in in the Italian side, for obvious reasons, and my favourite of the lot was a team-mate of his for a while: Lilian Thuram.
Modern coaches might do worse than play videos of him playing either as a fullback or a central defender to show not only is defending an art but one which can be accomplished with style.

As for Argentina - isn't the core problem with their defence that no matter how they set themselves up, they are notably pedestrian?

The real issue is they've been bridesmaids so often they doubt themselves
in key moments...at that level thats all your opponent needs

WC 2014 - they had enough 1 on 1s to win that final 3-1 instead of losing it 0-1

Even now Messi is talking about International retirement if they dont win the WC

3/2018
https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/...-a8262946.html

[seany65]

Originally Posted by Brecht

They softened since Heysel.

As did the Juventus fan who had what looked like a gun...

[judy84]

Soft in the head. But still the victims...


More than 300,000 people have now signed an online petition calling for Sergio Ramos to face action for “intentionally hurting” Mo Salah.


https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news...dmark-14714515

[buttsie]

Originally Posted by judy84

Soft in the head. But still the victims...


More than 300,000 people have now signed an online petition calling for Sergio Ramos to face action for “intentionally hurting” Mo Salah.


https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news...dmark-14714515

If only there was a Spanish Inquisitor nearby to get the truth out of him

The Salah injury was something the game could have done without

The karius blunders x2 ensured RM were always going to win


You never want to see the best players walking of injured in showpeace games
regardless of how it occured


So soon since Cristiano Ronaldo went off after 22 minutes and Portugal lifted their first international trophy because of their defence - since the golden generation was coined.

Oh the irony

[george anson]

Originally Posted by buttsie

The real issue is they've been bridesmaids so often they doubt themselves
in key moments...at that level thats all your opponent needs

WC 2014 - they had enough 1 on 1s to win that final 3-1 instead of losing it 0-1

Even now Messi is talking about International retirement if they dont win the WC

3/2018
https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/...-a8262946.html

The latest interview I read in Ole is that he wants to carry on regardless of what happens in Russia. I just hope the rest of the old guard retire. They had their chance and fluffed it.

Most specifically Gonzalo Higuain. He is without doubt the reason Argentina has missed out on silverware.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g8n689nMAKA

First effort. Nod the ball down. Get it under control round the keeper. The defenders are behind. Any challenge and it will be a penalty. Second effort. Batistuta scores from an identical angle by placing it across the goal. The third well. Shocking miss.

And Sampaoli still has not learnt. This awful miss in the friendly against Spain.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XIYig3Bc8hc

And poor once again last night against the might of Haiti.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vJJChfOyRmY

If anyone seriously thinks Argentina will be contenders for this World Cup they need their heads to be examined. A lack of movement off the ball, attacking space, deference to Messi and wasteful finishing again not just from Higuain but di Maria.

Messi played well as usual along with Lanzini, Lo Celso and Tagliafico. The introduction of Meza, Pavon and Aguero (all of whom were very sharp) saw three goals in ten minutes. However Mascherano looked vulnerable and the defence did not get tested although the two times Haiti looked threatening they looked panicked.

A lot of work for Sampaoli to do still. His refusal to include Icardi, Asascibar and others will come back to bite him I think. Mercado & Biglia did not feature at all so injury doubts still. Why take them in any case. And Armani a better keeper than Caballero stuck on the bench.

[buttsie]

Its strange how Managers keep going back to players who rarely replicate their exceptional club form at international level when it counts.

Raul for Spain probably the best example - finally dropped in 2006
Spain seemed to be a replica of Holland with the 2 club team rivalry undermining unity
for decades

Spain win 3 tournaments in a row

The French did a similar thing when they left Cantona & Ginola out because they were a better team without them.

[pierrelm]

Originally Posted by buttsie

Its strange how Managers keep going back to players who rarely replicate their exceptional club form at international level when it counts...
The French did a similar thing when they left Cantona & Ginola out because they were a better team without them.

Odd; Ramsey picked players because they played the way it suited his team plan, infamously leaving out Greaves who is undoubtedly one of the best ever English strikers. Whereas England latterly have had players who have been picked despite indifferent form and often played out of position because we've wanted to shoe-horn in our supposed best 11 players, irrespective of their ability to blend into a team worthy of the name. John Barnes was perceived as undroppable, irrespective of his increasingly indifferent displays for England, which made it all the more easy for those who wished to bait him. Beckham was seemingly undroppable (his Portuguese Euro campaign under Uncle Sven was appalling), Rooney similarly so. As for Hart...

Cantona was (to state the obvious) an enigma. Staggeringly talented, he never, ever looked the same player in a European club setting, oft anonymous or left out over the limitation on foreign players. It was, however, probably a relatively easy task to overlook him at a point where France had a pool of exceptionally strong midfield players.

England traditionally ignored the talented mavericks irrespective of the pedigree of the rest of the squad, or left it too late. LeTissier, Hoddle and Currie should have had many, many more caps than they were awarded, to name but three. Whereas if Beckham had looked like Beardsley I wonder how many caps he would have been gained? He'd have walked into the current squad, mind...

[m100]

Zidane has resigned.

If we all get together and pray in the genral direction of madrid will they appoint Wenger?