America

[teatsfan]

Originally Posted by Nobody1

In in a socialist system there is no such thing like private profit.

In academic theory (out of touch with reality), yes. But the countries of the Warsaw pact were/are legendary for corruption and filth within the ranks, where the party apparatschiks had many advantages over the normal citizens. The damage resulting from that corruption were burdened onto the public.

Originally Posted by Nobody1

"profits being privatised and losses being socialised" is simply a stupid mess, but has nothing to do with socialism.

It's how things actually work. You cannot deny that. Whether it fits into your theoretical definition of socialism or not.

[Estreeter]

Regular posters in the discussion threads will know I rarely contribute to these kinds of threads. I joined this forum for fun and not to make political statements or vent anger at any one particular nation, religious group, race, whatever, the exception being my own government and the odd semi serious anti communist statement.

SO a rarity,
Having been to the US, albeit it once, I loved it, and should I not been able to be an Australian born and raised citizen, I'd most certainly loved for it to be the US as a second preference.
I consider the United States of America and it's citizens my brothers and sisters. I'm thankful for it's existence and it's achievements. It's human nature for somebody to be at the top, been like that since UggaChugga bashed a lady on the head with his club and dragged her to his cave for their honeymoon. The same goes among nations, I'm glad the US is a superpower. I wouldn't want anybody else to be there, including my own. It's far too easy to bash the US for it's not so good deeds, Why does nobody look at their own nation ?
Imagine the US never existed, and don't come back saying we'd have had less wars, far too a simplistic view........look at everything they have done, Government, Industry, Individuals. Then have a look at your own countries achievements and or lack of them............I do in the What if you lived in Australia thread.


God Bless The United States of America

[billybunter]

Originally Posted by Estreeter

Regular posters in the discussion threads will know I rarely contribute to these kinds of threads. I joined this forum for fun and not to make political statements or vent anger at any one particular nation, religious group, race, whatever, the exception being my own government and the odd semi serious anti communist statement.

SO a rarity,
Having been to the US, albeit it once, I loved it, and should I not been able to be an Australian born and raised citizen, I'd most certainly loved for it to be the US as a second preference.
I consider the United States of America and it's citizens my brothers and sisters. I'm thankful for it's existence and it's achievements. It's human nature for somebody to be at the top, been like that since UggaChugga bashed a lady on the head with his club and dragged her to his cave for their honeymoon. The same goes among nations, I'm glad the US is a superpower. I wouldn't want anybody else to be there, including my own. It's far too easy to bash the US for it's not so good deeds, Why does nobody look at their own nation ?
Imagine the US never existed, and don't come back saying we'd have had less wars, far too a simplistic view........look at everything they have done, Government, Industry, Individuals. Then have a look at your own countries achievements and or lack of them............I do in the What if you lived in Australia thread.


God Bless The United States of America

I'm afraid I must beg to differ. I find your view simplistic. Government are you serious? The old world made the new world. And the Earth is not a nice place to be anymore. Every country has its individuals and industry. But most countries don't play it out on cinema screens and phony war.

[Nobody1]

Originally Posted by teatsfan

In academic theory (out of touch with reality), yes. But the countries of the Warsaw pact were/are legendary for corruption and filth within the ranks, where the party apparatschiks had many advantages over the normal citizens. The damage resulting from that corruption were burdened onto the public.

Seen in this way it's correct. Of course, there's a difference between theory and practice. But Corruption is worldwide and timeless. It's not limited to this or that social or economic model. You will always have this kind of harm, so long as this system consists of people. One can not completely eliminate this problem, unfortunately, but minimize. There is also a question what kind of values will be taught to future generations.

Originally Posted by teatsfan

It's how things actually work. You cannot deny that. Whether it fits into your theoretical definition of socialism or not.

Things are changing. If it were otherwise we wouldn't have universities but still shitting from the trees. You cannot deny that.

I must admit that this is a very tough road. And you really don't know if there is a light at the end of the tunnel. But as an idealist you have no other choice but to follow this path. Man does not live by bread alone. You also need hope for a better world.

Sorry, teatsfan i go to bed now. It's here 5 clock in the morning. Maybe someday we can continue.

[billybunter]

I will say one thing. This thread is close to collaspe. It should not be an anti-USA thread. It's a bit like running down the head master at school. Most Americans are decent people like my own country men and woman, and yours. There is a yank sitting in front of a screen just like paddy BB. We are not different, we are human. Trying to make it.

[botogames]

I'm proud to state I'm an American, I support my country and served to defend our laws of the land and the Constitution.

But...

Being an American. we have to be faced with the policies of our governments. We do have many to be faced with. Federal, State, County and City. After 911, we loss many of our freedoms, paranoid police, folks scared you could be the next terrorist. Believe me there are times where I do feel we are in a police state.

Today, we are in a state of finical ruin. Yes we had a near depression, if not we did have a depression and no one wanted to admit to it. High oil prices, home loan failures, loss of jobs (millions of them including me), Caoas in our federal level government.

Yes I would say we do have problems, funny to hear the folks from Canada complain about their taxes and how high they are. Trust me, we are being beaten to death here too. And I feel we are very close if not higher that the Canadians.

But remember, I live in a country where I can write about this and other issues without the government causing me issues... I'm sure they record this for future needs. But they allow us to be vocal. But I feel that too could become a past.

To all of you who visit my country, WELCOME!! we love to meet folks abroad; we are excited to meet folks from other places and we love to share our experiences and your places we call home. And to you who I have visited in Europe, UK, Ireland, Canada and many other countries... I have really enjoyed meeting your people and they too are super friendly too.

[Estreeter]

Originally Posted by billybunter

I'm afraid I must beg to differ. I find your view simplistic. Government are you serious? The old world made the new world. And the Earth is not a nice place to be anymore. Every country has its individuals and industry. But most countries don't play it out on cinema screens and phony war.

Sorry BB, my view is not simplistic....................Every Government on this planet to this day does things we don't know about and more than likely never will, those could be good or bad, as I said, we'll never know. The difference being with the US is it's done on a grander scale and under far more world scrutiny being effectively the sole remaining superpower. I'm not getting dragged into political debates, and won't be contributing to this thread unless it's going to be a light hearted or that thankful post. But right at this point in time, all I can think of is the Cold War with the Soviet Union and the space race that will enable you too read this post 2 seconds after I press submit reply

I'm also thankful for the US in it's involvement for helping save Australia during WW2,
I'm thankful for Henry Ford and providing me a job for 22 years of my 27 year working life.

The old world made the new world BB, The US won the cold war, and we have far less chance of the red button being pushed than say 30 years ago.................give me the new world. Where it's headed, we don't know. As far as I'm concerned the only people who can complain about the US and it's government are the US citizens themselves.

[Estreeter]

Originally Posted by billybunter

This thread is close to collaspe.

And that'll be the fault of the posters who want too flame, argue and so on..............shame. And should that happen, ask yourselves why.

My involvement form now

and won't be contributing to this thread unless it's going to be a light hearted or that thankful post

[Brecht]

The topic has been named "America" by the author who made a few points and invited us into a discussion. Some good points were made overall and they're not what simplistic bashing looks like. If some ordinary Americans identify with their governments (recent and historical ones), it is my right to claim that they have some serious moral issues. But I know the situation is the opposite. Just because I criticize the political situation in America (and its foreign policy), this most certainly doesn't express any hatred for America and its people. There is no difference between me and any American bloke here on VEF. The common man, wherever he is, should learn his lessons from history. Ordinary blokes have been shooting on ordinary blokes for no reasons. Flag-waving is the wrong path. I'm sure we're all just as critical of our own governments and nations but this topic is about America. We have a couple of similar threads, most of them started by Americans. Aren't they taking advantage of one of the most fundamental pillars of their constitution which is free spech? A country without critical citizens cannot be a healthy one. The reason why we have so many threads about the US and why they gain attention from non-Americans is its global influence. It's the only superpower who creates global rules, so deal with it. The US government is behaving in criminal way against its own people. Our American fellows here know better.

[billybunter]

Originally Posted by Estreeter

Sorry BB, my view is not simplistic....................Every Government on this planet to this day does things we don't know about and more than likely never will, those could be good or bad, as I said, we'll never know. The difference being with the US is it's done on a grander scale and under far more world scrutiny being effectively the sole remaining superpower. I'm not getting dragged into political debates, and won't be contributing to this thread unless it's going to be a light hearted or that thankful post. But right at this point in time, all I can think of is the Cold War with the Soviet Union and the space race that will enable you too read this post 2 seconds after I press submit reply

I'm also thankful for the US in it's involvement for helping save Australia during WW2,
I'm thankful for Henry Ford and providing me a job for 22 years of my 27 year working life.

The old world made the new world BB, The US won the cold war, and we have far less chance of the red button being pushed than say 30 years ago.................give me the new world. Where it's headed, we don't know. As far as I'm concerned the only people who can complain about the US and it's government are the US citizens themselves.

No disrespect. But to tell me and Vef your view is not simplistic, is only your opinion.