Communism. Good or bad. What do you really know about Communism?

[Wendigo]

Originally Posted by Licht

I did not hear the answer on the merits of my message. Learn to read something. that will be more difficult 3-4 words in one row. Communism collapses not for internal reasons ... but for reasons of external pressure. But there is no one to explain this.

Again you are an angry sausage, calm down you'll burst a blood vessel.
Communism collapses as a result of increased internal tensions, there may be some external issues but if Communism was as perfect as you think it is they could surely ride problems out, instead they always revert to the tried and trusted methods of security crackdowns as we saw in the Baltic states as Communist Russia was falling apart and the Chinese in Tiananmen Square.
Neither Communism or Capitalism are perfect but you cannot play the high moral standards trump card whilst defending Communism.

I am not interested in what Karl Marx wrote he was purely a thinker, it's how whenever his ideas are put into practice they always lead to totalitarianism.

[Licht]

Originally Posted by Wendigo

Again you are an angry sausage, calm down you'll burst a blood vessel.
Communism collapses as a result of increased internal tensions, there may be some external issues but if Communism was as perfect as you think it is they could surely ride problems out, instead they always revert to the tried and trusted methods of security crackdowns as we saw in the Baltic states as Communist Russia was falling apart and the Chinese in Tiananmen Square.
Neither Communism or Capitalism are perfect but you cannot play the high moral standards trump card whilst defending Communism.

I am not interested in what Karl Marx wrote he was purely a thinker, it's how whenever his ideas are put into practice they always lead to totalitarianism.

Well, if you read Marks, and did not pretend that you understand his ideas (acting on the principle - I did not read, but I condemn him), I would understand that he is the largest of all researchers of the principles of the development of capitalism (namely capitalism) .. from which he drew conclusions about his transformation. North Korea, the USSR and the Baltic States with China have nothing to do with it. There was no communism anywhere. I repeat once more - communism is a formation according to Marx. It is possible to transition to it as a consequence of the global crisis of the capitalist production system. And you are all talking about the USSR ... The experience of the USSR (social) is very heterogeneous ... And I was different from you in the US and Europe and in Russia ... naturally ...
The economic problems of this state do not rest solely in the internal conditions ... There is also the factor of "elites", the factor of external pressure, and the factor of ideological and political confrontation ... even the ethno-cultural factor ... The main thing is that there was no communism in the USSR ... can you imagine? What was then called communism ... just a special model of the command-administrative system. To Marxism, this model, by the way, was alien. Marks does not leave the description of communism ... only speaks about the probability of changing the mode of production and the transfer of means of production from one social quality to another. But I understand ... it's too complicated.

It is easier to believe that communism is a Chinese model - where 2 billion capitalists "build communism". A typical point of view .... resulting from a complete misunderstanding of the Marksist model.

Fans of sausages, we won in 1945... Including their Baltic bedding. Lovers of frogs - in 1812 ... Lovers of Swedish families in 1720s ... ... almost on our own. On the turn - hot dogs and burger lovers.
I drink vodka and kick ass. Forgot?

[Wendigo]

You say potAto I say pOtato.
You will never convince me that Marxism will ever work. I don't need to read his works to know that, just as I don't need to read the Bible as I am quite comfortable believing that there is no such thing as a God.

If your last point about the sausages was about your winning in WW2 let's not forget that Russia played both sides during that conflict and is still very uncomfortable about the Katyn forest massacres

[Roubignol]

Originally Posted by Licht

Well, if you read Marks, and did not pretend that you understand his ideas (acting on the principle - I did not read, but I condemn him), I would understand that he is the largest of all researchers of the principles of the development of capitalism (namely capitalism) .. from which he drew conclusions about his transformation. ....

Fans of sausages, we won in 1945... Including their Baltic bedding. Lovers of frogs - in 1812 ... Lovers of Swedish families in 1720s ... ... almost on our own. On the turn - hot dogs and burger lovers.
I drink vodka and kick ass. Forgot?

Let me give you an "good" advice. Do not waste your time to answer to people who don't read at least one line of a theory, but has an opinion about it.

Do you understand what I mean?

[Wendigo]

Originally Posted by xyzde69

Let me give you an "good" advice. Do not waste your time to answer to people who don't read at least one line of a theory, but has an opinion about it.

Do you understand what I mean?

No I'm afraid that one slipped by me like a hamster on roller skates.

I won't read about any more Scientology either but after reading the first few pages of Dianetics I knew it was a belief for weirdos. I don't need to read any more of either Hubbard or Marx, what I see put into practice in their names confirms my own personal beliefs.

[Roubignol]

Originally Posted by deepsepia

Not sure what your point is.

There's very little cobalt in a smartphone-- 5 to 10 grams.

Cobalt, for all your hyperventilating, isn't exactly rare.

The problem with cobalt mining is that you find the biggest deposits in the worst country. You don't like the conditions of mines in the DRC (Democratic Republic of the Congo), but do you think anything in the DRC is less than awful?

This is a spectacularly awful country from a governance perspective and human rights perspective; that has nothing to do with Apple, its just the way the DRC is.

I've watched a documentary explaining that the war in RDC is financed by computer enterprises.
By the way there are several Congolese generals who must be sent to the international tribunal because of war crimes and they are not, because the international community prefer to make business with them in exploiting miserable workers and incredible natural ressources instead to send them to the court.

That's today Capitalism.

Apple is an unfair enterprise that wastes energy, collaborate with third world slavedrivers, avoid to pay billions of taxes, hide illegal facts from their reports and damage the environment through planned obsolescence. After all the scandals that are described about Apple in medias and investigations, Apple's shareholders prove that they are uncaring investors.

[deepsepia]

Originally Posted by xyzde69

I've watched a documentary explaining that the war in RDC is financed by computer enterprises.

Nice. You watch Youtube videos and you think you know something.

One more time:

the DRC was a shit country long before cobalt was important. Its a lousy place for anyone to do anything. It sucks to be a DRC citizen, whether you're mining or doing anything else.

Now move forward to today: mining firms are busily developing cobalt mines in Queenlsand and Western Australia, where there's lots of cobalt.

And guess what?

Miners there will make lots of money, take their winnings back to Perth or Brisbane and have themselves a high old time, tricking out utes, buying few beer, losing some on the pokies, and hopefully wasting some on some otherwise useless women.

See, here's the essential difference: life in the DRC sucks. The government sucks. Life in Australia, on the other hand, is very good. The governments, whether liberal or labour, don't suck (though people whinge about both). So Australian mining will be capital intensive-- much more money will go in, miners will run machines instead of picking out bits of ore by hand . . . and so they'll be worth those much higher wages (a skilled Aussie miner can easily make over $100K).
See:
https://www.payscale.com/research/AU/Job=Miner/Salary

You have mistakenly conceived some complaint about "capitalism" based on a Youtube video, when in fact you're just looking at the fact that some nations have their shit together, and others don't.

[crinolynne]

Originally Posted by Wendigo

You say potAto I say pOtato.
You will never convince me that Marxism will ever work. I don't need to read his works to know that, just as I don't need to read the Bible as I am quite comfortable believing that there is no such thing as a God.

If your last point about the sausages was about your winning in WW2 let's not forget that Russia played both sides during that conflict and is still very uncomfortable about the Katyn forest massacres

Ah but you *do* need to read about his economic theory. Marx pointed out that labour was an un-evaluated and under-valued parameter in economics. Just as Dickens pointed out the over-value of capital and the over-value given to individual pursuit of self worth. As the 19th century proved, unchecked capitalism is evil - Marx, Dickens and many others brought the pendulum into balance and the world has benefited hugely.

[Roubignol]

Originally Posted by deepsepia

Nice. You watch Youtube videos and you think you know something.

French state TV.
I published on this topic the full details of this documentary and you didn't reply about it during several day.

I resume here a horrible documentary made by the state TV channel France 2 about "The secrets that you wouldn't know about our smartphones".

For an Iphone that costs about 900 €, the total Chinese workforce is paid… 2,38 €.
As example a Chinese worker had to verify 6000 screens per day (5 screens each 30 seconds) during 10 hours a day for … 70 cents per hour.

Chinese workers sleep at 8 together in a dormitory of 20 square meters.

Half of the workforce in Chinese enterprises that build smarphones are… children. They even work during the night and begin to work at 9 PM. They work during the night… every two monthes.

They have one free day every two weeks and two days of holiday per year. Children earn 160 € per month.

Before they were used to employ women instead of men, because it was easier to manage them.

Now women became too difficult to be managed, so it’s better to use children.
They cost less, are more disciplined, they obey better orders.

Smartphones are made by more than 300 pieces. The major parts of them are made of minerals.
During an interview of the manager of Nokia France (today a Microsoft company), he said: “We are transparent.” But when the journalists asked to the enterprise, could you provide us informations, where do you take your minerals and from which enterprises, the reply was: “It’s impossible for our company to be that transparent.”

Rubaya : Northern Kiwu. Republic Democratic of Congo.
A bag of 40 kg of coltan costs 600€ in Congo, but is sold 3500€ on international markets.
It makes 43°C in the mine, with rare oxygen.
African minors work 12 hours a day, for 5.5 € per day.
Each monthes about 50 minors get terrible traumas and a lot of them are handicapped for the rest of their life.
According to the Dr. Julio Carvisperri, he has to cure the injured minors, but he never see the dead minors. Why? Because when there is a landsline, the minors dig around the landsline. Buried minors already get their tombs.
Sometimes more than 200 minors died in the same landsline.
Families of dead minors still live in huts made of dried mud.
Yep… African foremen use smartphone, to call the team leaders to evacuate children of the mine, because it’s illegal to use under 15 years old children in the mine. But there are a lot of children.
Children are paid 0.40€ per day.
MHI is one of the Congolese enterprise that employs children minors. It collaborates for the American enterprise called AVX.
AVX sells coltan capacitor to Blackberry, Motorola or Nokia (owned by Microsoft).
According to the Dr Julio Carvisperri, Nokia or Motorola leaders never go to the African mines, because they would be considered as responsible to make children working.
According to this doctor, it’s called… slavery.

During a meeting, the journalist asked Bill Gates, what did he think about African children working in mines to build Microsoft smartphones? Bill Gates refused to comment.
“China labor watch” (a Chinese NGO) blames smartphones builders.
Samsung, Iphone, Motorola, Blackberry are considered to be among the less ethical companies in the world.
Several NGO proved that smartphones builders do not respect their ethical codes they advertise.
Smartphones builders pay holidays, travels, week-ends to computer journalists to promote their products.

China is facing huge environmental pollution because of producing… smartphones.

Why? Because they need to use magnetic material called neodyme.
In Northern Mongolia, in Baotou, there are the greatest mines of neodyme.
For 1 ton of Neodyme, 1 ton of pollution and 75’000 of liters of acid (called fluorid) are rejected in the nature.
600 000 tons of polluted material are rejected per year… only in this small area.
The zone is now… hugely radioactive.
Do you need a snapshot of the international radioactivity agency? Feel free to ask it. I’d glad to send it to you.
Mongols people and animals are suffering of radioactivity. They develop a lot of cancers.
In China, Baotou is called: The city of the cancers. 98% of the people going to the hospital, get terminal cancers.
John Higgins, the general director of Digital Europe, the enterprise that collaborates with Apple, Nokia, Blackberry and other companies, told that he had no idea about the pollution.
According to him, China and smartphone enterprises are both responsible about the environmental damages.
Smartphones enterprises finance a war in Republic Congo. This war has made between 3 to 5 millions dead people.
It’s the most lethal war since the WWII. The object, the mineral resources in RDC.

According to Martin Kobler, the chief of MONUSCO, smarphones enterprises are responsible. They are financing the war.
Smarphones enterprises collaborate with a screen company based in Hong-Kong that exploits the called : “minerals of blood”.
But the greatest company that buys the minerals of blood is called China national and they collaborate with…… APPLE.

Apart that, there are young American people fighting against the planned obsolescence promoted by Apple since the Iphone3.

Apple is a dirty unfair company. But became almost a sect with a lot of geeks.

[Estreeter]

Originally Posted by xyzde69

You do not understand anything. That's tragic.



Don't you see the absurdity of your behaviours?

Yeah I do, it's simple .....
The absurdity is that in this thread you state you want more to be paid and in another you say we don't need money to have a decent life

I understand that perfectly

You haven't explained how you go from one extreme to another, until you can explain your thought process there with 100% clarity none of your points hold any water ..... Go on, avoid the issue here

Originally Posted by Licht

Anti-Communists are stupid by definition.

I'd rather be a stupid anti communist who lives a comfortable life than a Pro Communist who looks for excuses to live a life that's seems like drudgery

Did I meantion we won, in case I forgot ..... we won.


Disclosure,
This post was bought to you by my Apple iMac whilst having a bacon and eggs breakfast