The Falklands War

**rupertramjet** · December 29th, 2012, 10:49 AM

Thirty Years ago we sailed as young men from Plymouth and Portsmouth, and a few other places, to the Falkland Islands. Most of us thought it was off Scotland! We came Home to a fantastic welcome and a proud nation. What are your memories, what are your thoughts, what are you doing now? An anything goes Thread, as long as its on topic.

**Rogerbh** · December 29th, 2012, 11:11 AM

As a US citizen, I recall watching the events unfold and wishing that Thatcher was our President instead of Reagan. She has huge brass balls. Sorry to hear of her current state of health.

By the way, I lost a bet that the Brits would lose because they were so outnumbered in the air.

Guess I should have remembered the Battle of Britain.

royalphoenix · December 29th, 2012, 11:25 AM

I was in the USMC at the time and remember it well. I was aboard the USS Nassau LHA-4 in the Mediterranean Sea. We were in port in Toulan, France more or less awaiting orders from Washington DC. Were very, very, very glad the British ended it as quick as they did. Argentina made a huge mistake.

**rupertramjet** · December 29th, 2012, 11:28 AM

WE were glad that Thatcher was in charge too!

An in joke in my Battalion was that if Labour had been in power they would not have retaliated if the Argentinians had landed on the Isle of Wight.

royalphoenix · December 29th, 2012, 11:40 AM

**scoundrel** · December 29th, 2012, 12:20 PM

One of the first duties of a nation-state is to defend its territory and defend its citizens from foreign invasion. The Labour Party, deep in its own internal and onanistic power games, pandered to its own left-wing fringe by adopting a pacifist line, arguing for mediation by a United Nations General Assembly which was widely known in Britain to be virulently anti-British and which would support Charles Manson against Great Britain in an international dispute. Labour was internally incapable of supporting a war to defend the Falkland Islands so UN mediation, no matter how ludicrous, was their solution to paper over their internal schisms.

This is the number one reason why Labour lost the next three general elections. Even millions of staunch bedrock Labour families who had supported Labour down the generations since Kier Hardy set it up were firmly alienated by a party which would not fight when British territory was invaded.

The British are not a timid people, but they usually find overt sabre rattling and flag waving rather disgusting, a reminder of Victorian imperialism which they like to think they have outgrown. They are not militaristic, and they look for peaceful solutons in preference to military solutions, because thats cheaper and cleaner all round. But in Britain, there are hidden currents, secret emotions which should be kept hidden. One of the reasons why we value courtesy and restraint is that, when our veneer is removed, we can be nasty nasty bastards (eg Dresden); we know this about ourselves and we try hard to keep it in its box. But very occasionally, when other nations mistake our mild demeanor for weakness, the hidden side comes out of its box and someone, somewhere, cries bitter tears that they ever knew us. The Argentinians are lucky; we fought that war in anger but without malice; and whenever they surrendered, we treated them fair. We managed to keep the worst things in their box where they belong.

**rupertramjet** · December 29th, 2012, 03:06 PM

As the Task Force sailed South, we were aware of the Diplomatic Moves going on at home. We did not know that the then Secretaty of State Al Haig, was intent on telling The Argentinians about British Plans to take South Georgia. Or that France was still equiping the Argentine Air Force with Excocet Missiles.

Morale was incredibly high, and with people doing target practice of the deck of the ship, PTIs shouting at us to work harder, we were enjoying our cruise.

**Rogerbh** · December 29th, 2012, 03:20 PM

I recall that the Harrier was an unproven aircraft and that the air to air odds were 15 to 1 as listed in my local newspaper (300 to 20 - thus my less than wise bet)

Far after the war ended, I believe I read that the French allowed practice dogfights with their Mirages and that the US had stopped selling disposable drop tanks to the Argentinians to help the Brits.

I also recall the great laughs we had at the Argentinian complaints that "little brown mercenaries" were going to be used against them. (Gurkhas)

The way the Brits beat the crap out of the Argentinians was rather awesome.

**scoundrel** · December 29th, 2012, 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rogerbh

I also recall the great laughs we had at the Argentinian complaints that "little brown mercenaries" were going to be used against them. (Gurkhas)

Chinese sailors from Hong Kong also served in the Falklands; they were an awfully long way from home. The Argentinian complaint is rather amusing; it is rarely justified to whine because the enemy won't fight fair. It's war, not tiddlywinks. It reminds of a great little exchange in the film The Cruel Sea, after Jack Hawkins as Captain Ericson of HMS Compass Rose has very reluctantly fished the survivors of the U Boat he just sank out of the water. He badly wanted to let them drown, but had just enough self respect not to stoop to that. Then, instead of being decently grateful, the U Boat captain attempts to be superior:

German captain: You caught my ship unawares,Captain. Otherwise...
Lt Comander Ericson: It was war, Captain. [dismissively] I am terribly sorry if its too hard for you.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rogerbh

The way the Brits beat the crap out of the Argentinians was rather awesome.

Usually in war, the winner is luckier than the loser, and Britain was very lucky not to lose; but I suppose Britain earned her luck by making a decision and standing by it. It was the stupid indecision of our Foreign Office, our Defence Ministry and our Treasury which first tempted the Argentinians to believe we wouldn't fight. That was the worst part of 2 April 1982 for me; knowing that the whole world was full of people who thought the British could safely be treated like this and expected that we would not fight. Then the fear, a terrible fear, that they would be right, that we would be craven and bleat to the UN for mediation. That fear was unspeakable, and explains why I never vote Labour, even though I often agree with their social policies. A country with no pride is finished. If we had not fought, I would have accepted that my country was finished and I would have emigrated and taken citizenship in a country which still had some balls.

**rupertramjet** · December 29th, 2012, 04:08 PM

Rogerbh, you are quiet right in the memory of the fear of the Argentinians over the Gurkhas. They were in awe of the little men from Nepal. With good reason, the boots of a Brirish Soldier traditionally are laced from eyehole to eyehole, with one end of the lace knotted and the other end used to tie the boot. This was, according to legend, because the Gurkhas, whilst patrolling would feel the boot laces and any laced otherwise, would immediately feel the wrath of the Kukri.

During a Battalion Strength Drop over Dartmoor in the 90s, two Gurkha Soldiers were positioned to set up an ambush, on the dropped Paras, due to poor weather, too much wind, the drop was aborted, the Gurkhas remained overnight, because no one thought to tell them otherwise.

December 29th, 2012, 10:49 AM	#1
rupertramjet R.I.P. Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Cloud cuckoo land Posts: 4,300 Thanks: 26,852 Thanked 54,117 Times in 4,288 Posts	The Falklands War Thirty Years ago we sailed as young men from Plymouth and Portsmouth, and a few other places, to the Falkland Islands. Most of us thought it was off Scotland! We came Home to a fantastic welcome and a proud nation. What are your memories, what are your thoughts, what are you doing now? An anything goes Thread, as long as its on topic.

December 29th, 2012, 11:40 AM	#5
royalphoenix Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 35 Thanks: 1,292 Thanked 281 Times in 33 Posts	rofl

December 29th, 2012, 12:20 PM	#6
scoundrel Super Moderator Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: England Posts: 26,237 Thanks: 162,389 Thanked 278,408 Times in 26,182 Posts	One of the first duties of a nation-state is to defend its territory and defend its citizens from foreign invasion. The Labour Party, deep in its own internal and onanistic power games, pandered to its own left-wing fringe by adopting a pacifist line, arguing for mediation by a United Nations General Assembly which was widely known in Britain to be virulently anti-British and which would support Charles Manson against Great Britain in an international dispute. Labour was internally incapable of supporting a war to defend the Falkland Islands so UN mediation, no matter how ludicrous, was their solution to paper over their internal schisms. This is the number one reason why Labour lost the next three general elections. Even millions of staunch bedrock Labour families who had supported Labour down the generations since Kier Hardy set it up were firmly alienated by a party which would not fight when British territory was invaded. The British are not a timid people, but they usually find overt sabre rattling and flag waving rather disgusting, a reminder of Victorian imperialism which they like to think they have outgrown. They are not militaristic, and they look for peaceful solutons in preference to military solutions, because thats cheaper and cleaner all round. But in Britain, there are hidden currents, secret emotions which should be kept hidden. One of the reasons why we value courtesy and restraint is that, when our veneer is removed, we can be nasty nasty bastards (eg Dresden); we know this about ourselves and we try hard to keep it in its box. But very occasionally, when other nations mistake our mild demeanor for weakness, the hidden side comes out of its box and someone, somewhere, cries bitter tears that they ever knew us. The Argentinians are lucky; we fought that war in anger but without malice; and whenever they surrendered, we treated them fair. We managed to keep the worst things in their box where they belong. __________________ To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode

December 29th, 2012, 11:11 AM	#2
Rogerbh Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Land of the free within reasonable limitations Posts: 10,900 Thanks: 50,520 Thanked 91,159 Times in 10,748 Posts	As a US citizen, I recall watching the events unfold and wishing that Thatcher was our President instead of Reagan. She has huge brass balls. Sorry to hear of her current state of health. By the way, I lost a bet that the Brits would lose because they were so outnumbered in the air. Guess I should have remembered the Battle of Britain.

December 29th, 2012, 11:25 AM	#3
royalphoenix Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 35 Thanks: 1,292 Thanked 281 Times in 33 Posts	I was in the USMC at the time and remember it well. I was aboard the USS Nassau LHA-4 in the Mediterranean Sea. We were in port in Toulan, France more or less awaiting orders from Washington DC. Were very, very, very glad the British ended it as quick as they did. Argentina made a huge mistake.

December 29th, 2012, 11:28 AM	#4
rupertramjet R.I.P. Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Cloud cuckoo land Posts: 4,300 Thanks: 26,852 Thanked 54,117 Times in 4,288 Posts	WE were glad that Thatcher was in charge too! An in joke in my Battalion was that if Labour had been in power they would not have retaliated if the Argentinians had landed on the Isle of Wight.

December 29th, 2012, 03:06 PM	#7
rupertramjet R.I.P. Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Cloud cuckoo land Posts: 4,300 Thanks: 26,852 Thanked 54,117 Times in 4,288 Posts	As the Task Force sailed South, we were aware of the Diplomatic Moves going on at home. We did not know that the then Secretaty of State Al Haig, was intent on telling The Argentinians about British Plans to take South Georgia. Or that France was still equiping the Argentine Air Force with Excocet Missiles. Morale was incredibly high, and with people doing target practice of the deck of the ship, PTIs shouting at us to work harder, we were enjoying our cruise.

December 29th, 2012, 03:20 PM	#8
Rogerbh Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Land of the free within reasonable limitations Posts: 10,900 Thanks: 50,520 Thanked 91,159 Times in 10,748 Posts	I recall that the Harrier was an unproven aircraft and that the air to air odds were 15 to 1 as listed in my local newspaper (300 to 20 - thus my less than wise bet) Far after the war ended, I believe I read that the French allowed practice dogfights with their Mirages and that the US had stopped selling disposable drop tanks to the Argentinians to help the Brits. I also recall the great laughs we had at the Argentinian complaints that "little brown mercenaries" were going to be used against them. (Gurkhas) The way the Brits beat the crap out of the Argentinians was rather awesome.

December 29th, 2012, 04:08 PM	#10
rupertramjet R.I.P. Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Cloud cuckoo land Posts: 4,300 Thanks: 26,852 Thanked 54,117 Times in 4,288 Posts	Rogerbh, you are quiet right in the memory of the fear of the Argentinians over the Gurkhas. They were in awe of the little men from Nepal. With good reason, the boots of a Brirish Soldier traditionally are laced from eyehole to eyehole, with one end of the lace knotted and the other end used to tie the boot. This was, according to legend, because the Gurkhas, whilst patrolling would feel the boot laces and any laced otherwise, would immediately feel the wrath of the Kukri. During a Battalion Strength Drop over Dartmoor in the 90s, two Gurkha Soldiers were positioned to set up an ambush, on the dropped Paras, due to poor weather, too much wind, the drop was aborted, the Gurkhas remained overnight, because no one thought to tell them otherwise.