Communism. Good or bad. What do you really know about Communism?

[Nobody1]

Originally Posted by LaughingBoy

VERY well put!

I'm no Poly Sci Major, but from my (fairly) well informed man on the street position, the best system for the maximized Utility, would be democratic socialism.

Hmm....I wonder what socialism is, and where it comes from.

[Roubignol]

Originally Posted by Wendigo

I hate apologists for tyrants.

Behind the word "dividends" are hidden implacable tyrants.

Tyrants who exploit Third World workers without any pity, who destroy ecosystems to waste oil, to dig and then burry gold, diamants; who terrorize workers and their families by relocating or closing businesses, who sell and promote junk food in the way to get addicted customers, who put farm animals under miserable life conditions, who inflict useless tortures to laboratory animals to sell dubious drugs, etc, etc...

Look carefully around you and analyze the today reality and you will deeply dislike apologists of Capitalism.

[otokonomidori]

Originally Posted by xyzde69

Behind the word "dividends" are hidden implacable tyrants.

Tyrants who exploit Third World workers without any pity, who destroy ecosystems to waste oil, to dig and then burry gold, diamants; who terrorize workers and their families by relocating or closing businesses, who sell and promote junk food in the way to get addicted customers, who put farm animals under miserable life conditions, who inflict useless tortures to laboratory animals to sell dubious drugs, etc, etc...

Look carefully around you and analyze the today reality and you will deeply dislike apologists of Capitalism.

It's hypocritical for someone to enjoy the pleasures and conveniences of Capitalism while sneering at it.

"Capitalism is what people do if you leave them alone."

[SanteeFats]

Originally Posted by xyzde69

Behind the word "dividends" are hidden implacable tyrants.

Tyrants who exploit Third World workers without any pity, who destroy ecosystems to waste oil, to dig and then burry gold, diamants; who terrorize workers and their families by relocating or closing businesses, who sell and promote junk food in the way to get addicted customers, who put farm animals under miserable life conditions, who inflict useless tortures to laboratory animals to sell dubious drugs, etc, etc...

Look carefully around you and analyze the today reality and you will deeply dislike apologists of Capitalism.

Okay X you post a lot of highfalutin opinions and viewpoints but what do you yourself do for a living?? In most cases if you are working for some one else you are what you rail against, IMO.

[LaughingBoy]

Originally Posted by footstep

There ain't any.
Any.

Not true.

Socialist democracies kick quite a bit of ass.

Properly regulated, Capitalism kicks ass. It motivates people better than Marxism. Look at the 50's through the 80's ...a fairly high tax rate kept money in circulation, instead of being squirreled away in the Caymans... and the ecomony thrived! The middle class grew...home ownership shot up. The economy was a Gorilla kicking ass... Fat and happy...

Capitalism without regulation quickly leads to our Corporate Overlords ruling the show...as they do now... If the boardroom doesn't want it...it WON'T happen.

[LaughingBoy]

Originally Posted by SanteeFats

Okay X you post a lot of highfalutin opinions and viewpoints but what do you yourself do for a living?? In most cases if you are working for some one else you are what you rail against, IMO.

Santee, unless you come from Money...you have been a wage slave at some point...we all have...I STILL am...though I own my own business...if I don't work...my kids and I don't eat. This is a fair thing. Marxism doesn't motivate well. Capitalism does.

X is not a hypocrite. We all live in systems...a bunch of them...Just because he lives in a system doesn't mean he can't rail against the injustices or shortcomings of that system. He has eyes...he can see that the planet is being abused in some ways.

Capitalism is not without benefit, but it also has it's poison. If the captains of industry are not held to task by rules, they will do whatever they like. Ask any family that lives by a fracking site.

Are the benefits of Capitalism nifty?

You bet they are! Drinking yummy Kona coffee, watching spongebob on my bitchin' new huge big screen this morning while scarfing down Sugar Bombs with the Boys...was heaven! It sure beat the shit out of standing in a bread line in holey shoes, only to have the bread run out.

I am blessed beyond measure. It doesn't mean I shouldn't try and make a better world for the Shortypants.

I love this forum. I love VEF. I get to adult in every sense of the word. I love this exchange of ideas and I love learning from you guys. More's the pity that we're spread so far and wide and I'll never tilt a scotch with any one of you. However, I will toast you all the very next chance I get.

(Sorry to meander off topic there, but I had to thank you dudes for making this discussion a cool place to be.)

[Roubignol]

Originally Posted by SanteeFats

Okay X you post a lot of highfalutin opinions and viewpoints but what do you yourself do for a living?? In most cases if you are working for some one else you are what you rail against, IMO.

I'm a vegan slave (and quite glad to be one )

Analysing the facts, listening to and reading spiritual people and humanists, I became an anti Wall Street, anti City, anti shareholders. They are parasites, who use money for their own benefits and exploiting environment and disarmed weak people (or animals).

If we want to get a better society for the next generation, we have to destroy capitalism and create an fair antispecist society.

[bowlinggreen]

Originally Posted by xyzde69

I'm a vegan slave (and quite glad to be one )

Analysing the facts, listening to and reading spiritual people and humanists, I became an anti Wall Street, anti City, anti shareholders. They are parasites, who use money for their own benefits and exploiting environment and disarmed weak people (or animals).

If we want to get a better society for the next generation, we have to destroy capitalism and create an fair antispecist society.

No matter what system you are under, there will always be exploitation. This is the nature of hierarchy. Some will always have it better than others. This goes for all creatures, not just humans. The alpha male wolf eats better than the low wolf on the totem pole, in the wolf pack. The drone bee lives comfortably in the hive, while the female worker bees hustle their asses to feed the drone so he can reproduce more hives elsewhere. The biggest bull in the buffalo herd fucks more cows than the other bulls, because his genes are better, and because he can.

The only way for you not to exploit anyone else is to find a desert island to live on, and never trade with other humans again. You will find that to be a somewhat uncomfortable life, just watch Tom Hanks in "Cast Away" noshing on his nasty crab and fish. No scotch on a desert island either, or clothes, to say nothing of no women to fuck. You might get lucky and have the tide wash a waterlogged copy of Hustler up onto your beach, I suppose.

Your other alternative is to invent the replicator from Star Trek and give every human being on earth one. But I don't think you are going to do that.

Failing these two options, you only other is to bleat about how cruel and unfair the world is, which you have already been doing. And if you think about it, that is a capitalist indulgence in and of itself.

[Roubignol]

Originally Posted by bowlinggreen

Failing these two options, you only other is to bleat about how cruel and unfair the world is, which you have already been doing. And if you think about it, that is a capitalist indulgence in and of itself.

In the past you already told that I was the result of an awry process of evolution.

Which I totally agree about the fact that if the goal of a living creature is to become eternal through the process of procreation... that's clear, in my case evolution failed.
Between a pure psychopath or a hypocrite who more or less consciously let a field of life ruined for his babies and a dreamy utopian who will not reproduce himself after observing that this world is too rude, the result will be the same: the end of human life.
But the main difference will be that psychopathic and hypocritical parents could be accused of "no assistance to the person in danger".

Between these two extremes, there must be several good compromises to regulate this unfair system, to let the choice to the next generations (and other species) to run their life, their futures ?

That's terrible, but still today a majority of our states and medias are promoting greed. Consumers and leaders defend workers exploitation without observing that they would not like to be exploited. Through educations they promote competition instead of collaboration. Our economy promote private properties, consumerism, waste of energy.

As Nobody1 described in another topic: Lobbies are far too strong.
Even Obama told that when his administration wrote a law to fight the minerals of blood.

[Estreeter]

Originally Posted by otokonomidori

It's hypocritical for someone to enjoy the pleasures and conveniences of Capitalism while sneering at it.

Mate, I'll expand on that a little

I love this thread for one reason, rubbishing Commies and Marxists and then exposing things.

See, time and time again we have seen certain members here bring up that big companies exploit those who are poor, I've seen the word fair use a lot also.

Well those same members are members of a forum which centers around, erotica porn A lot of the material posted on this entire forum some say, exploits women

Not only that, the same members have viewed material on this forum and not paying for it ... a form of robbing I think.

I'd call that a major contradiction in their thinking or is it selective

Yep, I love Commies preaching morals