Current Politics in the United Kingdom

[Devius]

Theresa May has launched her strongest attack on Russia yet, accusing Moscow of meddling in elections and carrying out cyber espionage.

Speaking at the Lord Mayor's banquet in London, the prime minister said Vladimir Putin's government was trying to "undermine free societies".

Mrs May said they were "planting fake stories" to "sow discord in the West".

But, she added, whilst the UK did not want "perpetual confrontation" with Russia, it would protect its interests.

Her comments are in stark contrast to those of US President Donald Trump, who last week said he believed President Putin's denial of intervening in the 2016 presidential election.

Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson is due to visit Russia next month.

Mrs May said as the UK left the EU and charted a new course in the world, it remained absolutely committed to Nato and securing a Brexit deal which "strengthens our liberal values", adding that a strong economic partnership between the UK and EU would be a bulwark against Russian agitation in Europe.

Full details:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-41973043

No disrespect Mrs May (ok, a little ) - but you taking on Putin is like Gabriel vs Lucifer in "Constantine".

[palo5]

Originally Posted by haroldeye

Garnier and Co should be politely told to go and play with each others private parts. We should just stand up and say enough. Goodbye,

Oh dear! You sound like that deluded imbecile Johnson in this post, my friend

If you invite the animosity of the biggest trading bloc in the world, do not expect it to go well

Originally Posted by Devius

Theresa May has launched her strongest attack on Russia yet, accusing Moscow of meddling in elections and carrying out cyber espionage...

Yes, and like the Americans she offers no evidence. She's beginning to sound like Hillary Clinton -- no credibility at all. We're told many in her party want to dump her

No disrespect Mrs May (ok, a little ) - but you taking on Putin is like Gabriel vs Lucifer in "Constantine

No, it's much worse -- it's like May trying to take on Putin

[bloke57]

Originally Posted by Devius

Theresa May has launched her strongest attack on Russia yet, accusing Moscow of meddling in elections and carrying out cyber espionage...

I bet we are doing much the same in reverse. I'd think the Foreign Office was sleeping on the job if it didn't.

[palo5]

Originally Posted by Wendigo

...when Britain joined the EU it was sold to us in the 1970's as a Common Market; what we never voted for is to be ruled on every aspect of our lives by faceless Eurocrats...

Very bad argument, imho. It's true you joined a common market, but every evolution since then has been supported by your government, and you know that. When they didn't like it, they got "opt-outs". You know that too. You also got a rebate, which means you don't pay as much to the EU as you should, and almost never have

"Every aspect of our lives" and "faceless Eurocrats" is a brainless fallacy for unenquiring minds. The EU does not dictate your foreign policy, tax policy, immigration policy, police policy, defense policy etc etc. It even allows your corrupt financial sector to ruin economies. So what are your problems? That they tell you, that you have to adhere to food quality standards, that you need hygiene in food production, that you need to be in line with technical developments in your legislation?

Give me a break, please. They're only telling you what you should know anyway

As for "faceless Eurocrats" you can look them up on the web. Almost no one in the EU knows who your representatives are either, but it doesn't mean their input is hated

[otokonomidori]

Originally Posted by palo5

If you invite the animosity of the biggest trading bloc in the world, do not expect it to go well

We've survived much worse hostility than that.

As for the EU business-i t's no different from buying an old car . Willingness to walk away has to be an option in any deal making process - if the other side knows you aren't willing to do that they will rip the piss right out of you.

[palo5]

Originally Posted by otokonomidori

We've survived much worse hostility than that

Only from the English

As for the EU business-i t's no different from buying an old car...

I know they lied to you, but didn't know it know it was that crude

If you bought that.... well didn't anyone tell you not to be a simpleton?

[Wendigo]

Originally Posted by palo5

Very bad argument, imho. It's true you joined a common market,

So far so good, if only you had put your Pravda approved keyboard away at that point.

Originally Posted by palo5

but every evolution since then has been supported by your government, and you know that. When they didn't like it, they got "opt-outs". You know that too. You also got a rebate, which means you don't pay as much to the EU as you should, and almost never have

Very bad counter argument imho
Did Poland, Romania, Hungary & others vote to join the Warsaw Pact ?
NO the people were forced into a post war arranged marriage and had no say when the USSR regime turned it's more brutal face towards them.
The other EU nations must have agreed that Britain was paying over the odds or else why did they agree to the rebate?? Were they just stupid????

Originally Posted by palo5

"Every aspect of our lives" and "faceless Eurocrats" is a brainless fallacy for unenquiring minds. The EU does not dictate your foreign policy, tax policy, immigration policy, police policy, defense policy etc etc. It even allows your corrupt financial sector to ruin economies. So what are your problems? That they tell you, that you have to adhere to food quality standards, that you need hygiene in food production, that you need to be in line with technical developments in your legislation?

Foreign policy - The EU dictates who we can trade with, all deals have to be agreed.
Police policy - The UK opted out EU policing and criminal justice measures
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/u...stice-measures
The fact we opted out means these measures exist
Defence policy - https://eeas.europa.eu/topics/common...policy-csdp_en

No matter how you slice it the EU by its very nature has its claws in every policy sector, it is an embryonic European super state. Britain voted against that in a fair vote, we chose to be governed by our own Parliament, just accept it and move on, nothing more to see here, it happened, live with it

Believe it or not we actually had laws before we joined the EEC.

Originally Posted by palo5

Give me a break, please. They're only telling you what you should know anyway

No breaks here .....sorry but people still moaning about what happened a year on after the vote is is pretty feeble.

Lies were told on all sides of the argument. That's the nature of politics

[seany65]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wendigo
...when Britain joined the EU it was sold to us in the 1970's as a Common Market; what we never voted for is to be ruled on every aspect of our lives by faceless Eurocrats...

Originally Posted by palo5

Very bad argument, imho. It's true you joined a common market, but every evolution since then has been supported by your government, and you know that. When they didn't like it, they got "opt-outs". You know that too. You also got a rebate, which means you don't pay as much to the EU as you should, and almost never have

"Every aspect of our lives" and "faceless Eurocrats" is a brainless fallacy for unenquiring minds. The EU does not dictate your foreign policy, tax policy, immigration policy, police policy, defense policy etc etc. It even allows your corrupt financial sector to ruin economies. So what are your problems? That they tell you, that you have to adhere to food quality standards, that you need hygiene in food production, that you need to be in line with technical developments in your legislation?

Give me a break, please. They're only telling you what you should know anyway

As for "faceless Eurocrats" you can look them up on the web. Almost no one in the EU knows who your representatives are either, but it doesn't mean their input is hated

Comrade Palo5-ski, What I think wendigo is actually alluding to is we were told by our Govt. that the Birt Govt. wanted to join a loose federation of countries that had got together to make trading a bit easier. They did so without a vote by the British public. When, several years later we were asked to vote on whether to stay in it, that is what we believed.

We had no idea that the EEC (European Economic Community) as we understood it never really existed and that the whole point of the organisation was to get total european integration into an increasingly (albeit slowly increasingly) powerful monolithic state, the founders of which never believed that the general public should know about this plan nor have a vote on the plan.

Some of us are coming to see this, and coming to mistrust the future that the EU's leaders want for the EU and the individual countries that at present make it up.

Some of us see no reason why each country in the EU needs to disappear into a European superstate in order for us to trade together. No-one has asked africa to join/disapear in the EU and we trade with them. No-one has asked china to join and disappear in the EU and we trade with them, so why do european countries have to disappear in ordere to trade in europe?

The 'power' that the EU has now is miniscule compared to the power they want. Why else would they want a single integrated European army? Why esle are they slowly getting the laws toghether necassary for single judicial system?

Why esle does the EU prevent any EU member making it's own trade deals with other countries? Is it really just to be sure that safety standards are maintained?

[steamjon]

Originally Posted by palo5

Very bad argument, imho. It's true you joined a common market, but every evolution since then has been supported by your government, and you know that. When they didn't like it, they got "opt-outs". You know that too. You also got a rebate, which means you don't pay as much to the EU as you should, and almost never have

"Every aspect of our lives" and "faceless Eurocrats" is a brainless fallacy for unenquiring minds. The EU does not dictate your foreign policy, tax policy, immigration policy, police policy, defense policy etc etc. It even allows your corrupt financial sector to ruin economies. So what are your problems? That they tell you, that you have to adhere to food quality standards, that you need hygiene in food production, that you need to be in line with technical developments in your legislation?

Give me a break, please. They're only telling you what you should know anyway

As for "faceless Eurocrats" you can look them up on the web. Almost no one in the EU knows who your representatives are either, but it doesn't mean their input is hated

You made a better rebuttal on some of the Brexit arguments than the pro remain politicians.

[otokonomidori]

Originally Posted by palo5

Only from the English



I know they lied to you, but didn't know it know it was that crude

If you bought that.... well didn't anyone tell you not to be a simpleton?

We're all British here Palo.

Simple as it is [and as I am in your opinion], I stand by my contention that willingness to walk away from negotiations by either party, is a essential part of any deal making process.