Holocaust:True Or False ?

[Faceman675]

Originally Posted by srksmeghead

It is sickening that certain people do not believe these atrocities happened,
probably the same people who believe we never went to the moon.

Originally Posted by Mal Hombre

"Holocaust Deniers" only deny it because They can't justify it.All these Nazi apologists and anti-semites deny it in public but no doubt gloat about it in private.

To me there is a huge difference in motivation. Conspiracy nuts that believe that man never walked on the moon truly believe it, while I think Mal nailed holocaust deniers as being anti-semites. When I have tried to engage deniers in debate it always is turned by deniers to current events in Israel. Why? 2 different subjects. There is no doubt that deniers are anti-Semites.

[martynz]

and had even prepared war crimes indictments against Adolf Hitler and his top Nazi commanders.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...-a7688036.html

[Puhbear69]

Originally Posted by martynz

The Allied Powers were aware of the scale of the Jewish Holocaust two-and-a-half years earlier than is generally assumed,
and had even prepared war crimes indictments against Adolf Hitler and his top Nazi commanders.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...-a7688036.html

They must have been aware since 1936 - 1939, but not official / public.

Evidences:
Ships with Jews where send back all over the world.
The British, USA, Argentina, Egypt and Palestine (British occupied) send back all the Jews (-Ships) to Germany. Most made literately an Odesy.

It seems to me, in a first step Hitler doesn't wanted to kill all those Jews - this came a bit later. Of course they were robbed before, there was very little cash allowed.

[SanteeFats]

Originally Posted by Puhbear69

They must have been aware since 1936 - 1939, but not official / public.

It seems to me, in a first step Hitler doesn't wanted to kill all those Jews - this came a bit later.

Definitely have to disagree Puh. IMO Hitler hated Semites for awhile.
The link below is from an admittedily biased source but----

http://www.annefrank.org/en/Anne-Fra...-antisemitism/

[Puhbear69]

Originally Posted by SanteeFats

Definitely have to disagree Puh. IMO Hitler hated Semites for awhile.
The link below is from an admittedly biased source but----

http://www.annefrank.org/en/Anne-Fra...-antisemitism/

Hitler didn't hated the Semites really. It was part of his very brutal strategy to catch (simple-) voters; today we call those people "populists" of different directions. Correct is, that he made the thoughts of Karl Lueger to his own.
There were others before he got in charge. But he was telling about the "World Judaism" in "Mein Kampf" before.

So I came to this consideration: in a first step he wanted them lost, out of Germany. As this seemed to be failed, .....

[Mal Hombre]

That's it,He wanted the Jews out of Europe,When He couldn't resettle Them anywhere,He decided on genocide.

[footstep]

God bless 6 millions Jewish died.

[footstep]

Shoah Claude Lanzmann.
Raul Hillberg and many true historian. etc..

[scoundrel]

Exactly how and why the project evolved to murder a whole race of people is not definitively catalogued in terms of who decided what and when. But it seems clear enough that this project did evolve over time. Hitler's pathalogical hatred for Jews and others (Russians, Gypsies, homosexuals not the only ones) went back at least to Landsberg prison and the writing of Mein Kampf. But it is not clear that he had a plan to exterminate such people as far back as that.

I think there was a snowball effect as people with passionate hatreds gathered together under one banner. Not only was Hitler not the only murderous anti-semitic nut-job in the room, he was by no means the most stridently and energetically focused murderer in the room. He liked to signal direction and then let the minions do the hard work. In the hate tent he had Goebbels for the well-poisoning; Bormann as a bag carrier and Himmler and Heydrich to make the actual bad deeds happen. There were plenty of others helping to provide the suitable ambience; people like the odious Robert Ley, Alfred Rosenberg (who was garotted very slowly by the Nuremberg hangman but deserves no sympathy); Julius Streicher, who wrote prolifically on anti-semitic topics and would have dishonoured the noble word "scum". These people egged each other on and became cumulatively more open and brutal in their actions and thoughts as the time went by.

[Brecht]

You may want to read about the so-called Madagascar Plan. I don't know how accurate this article is but it gives you an approximate idea about some of the ideas behind the planned relocation of the European Jews. Those ideas were not exclusively German but it was the Germans who decided to carry out a genocide.